Earnie Shavers' Power Quotes- An Explanation

Both Foreman and Shavers stopped Caldwell in rd 2. George turned the trick before Earnie did and George managed it 6 seconds faster - very close but it seems fair to conclude that Foreman punched 6 seconds harder than Shavers.

If it was lost in translation, I am clearly joking. However, as the case is for Earnie, we don’t have film of Foreman v Caldwell either. Now Caldwell said that Shavers hit harder than Foreman and Lyle combined. Obviously disposed to give Earnie his due credit and then some.

Now the fight v Lyle came before both Foreman and Shavers. Lyle won a UD over Caldwell over the course of just 5 rds. I’ve read a summary account of this fight and it seems Caldwell was very evasive, avoiding any real engagement and likely Lyle didn’t land anything significant enough for Caldwell to make a fair comparison. He can say Earnie hit him the hardest but perhaps be more realistic by saying he didn’t really taste Lyle’s full power to properly rate it. We know Ron had good power but he didn’t always accent on unleashing it like GF and ES.

 

Which chin was the best that Earnie cracked?

Some might say perhaps Roy Williams? Unfortunately, that fight isn’t necessarily a testament to Shavers’ one punch power. I’m talking “above all” power because Earnie was still hitting very hard with each and every punch.. Strangely, Williams ignored his own jab and quick handed combo punching. That allowed Earnie to land periodically with heavy leather over 9 rds = cumulative damage. Shortly after receiving a standing 8 count, Earnie did wobble an equally fatigued Williams with a single right hand that opened the door for Earnie to land a number of clubbing shots to force an standing 8 count which Williams collapsed afterward anyway.

Point being, while it demonstrated a good retention of power (though Williams was tired too), it didn’t necessarily advertise single punch power well beyond some other known punchers, rather, the finish wasn’t entirely dissimilar to Foreman’s ultimate batting down of Lyle over half the rds.

That ref was awfully brave on both Shavers’ and Williams’ parts. Both standing 8s could’ve easily seen outright stoppages under other referees.

 

And one more thing…….LOL.

If I was a fighter, perhaps one of the better ways to judge power would be the punches that land on relatively less vulnerable/vital spots. Areas that don’t necessarily contain “little switches” that either mercifully numb the experience of pain temporarily or you into the world of unconsciousness outright.

You often hear fighters say “He hurt me even when he hit (insert body part of your choice )…”. They might say their arm, shoulder, forearm etc., areas where, while your brain isn’t effected directly, you’re allowed the pleasure of feeling the force and associated pain of the punch (if that makes sense). Same goes with comparing flush hits to those same areas as opposed to grazing shots.

Kind of like Marciano opponents testifying to the degree of his punching power saying it hurt where ever he hit you. The power carried in those type of shots isn’t as discernible (to the viewer, not recipient) as those made to the head or other vital areas where raw power can be confused with accuracy and overt brain effected reaction when just the right spot is hit.

 

Rahman could punch too but regardless I feel like we're kind of off track of my point, which is only that one standout trait often fails to bring the results even if it's a really great standout like Shavers' power, or anyone's power. It's like, so what if Amir Khan might have even slightly faster hands than Ray Leonard who was blazing? One was a very good fighter and one was one of the best fighters ever. But if it's only about hand speed...so what? You can get a bunch of chances to get a high quality win with a highlight reel kayo and fail with great power because you're just not that good as a total package. It's not a point about Sam Peter, so much as tangentially relating him as one of many, many guys whose power really impressed other fighters, trainers, etc, but left them still underwhelming to most of us when it came to official results. But mind I'm only quoting Steward, not making the claim in my own opinion.

I find it just not that intriguing or provocative. It's about as shoulder-shrugging to me as Joe Louis saying Lee Ramage made less mistakes in a round than Billy Conn in a whole fight or something like that. It's like, okay, Ramage is basically barely a name fighter in boxing history, for whatever reasons, but say he was at least really proficient and focused for whatever reason compared to a true great on the occasions they met Louis in the ring. I mean, whatever. It seems baffling but maybe it's not so outlandish?

And, you know, you can just say Maskaev's age, for instance, but did the guy have that title or not? It's world level power proven at least at world title level. And is Maskaev's chin so much worse than Norton's? Norton's one of my favourite fighters ever but could you see the fittest Samuel knocking him out for his own WBC title? I certainly could. I don't want to see it, but I can easily imagine it as realistic. Peter, as you admit, had some good stuff going for him, but the lower quality aspects I feel are definitely enough to drag down the kayo proof. His career was absolutely decimated by fitness issues and temperament issues. I could've just as easily said Jeff Lacy, because he was simply not that good for a titlist, and people in the know were enormously impressed with his power. I mentioned Haye and DaVarryl Williamson, but these guys are all over the place at pretty low levels, guys who are barely regional names, let alone even fringe contender status that most of us would recognise but they set off gym legends because damn can they punch and damn does it not mean anything to the world. I mean, it's like the likelihoods of having a grand piano waiting to push off a ledge to see if you can hit someone if they happen to walk by or just having a baseball in your jacket pocket so when you see them you can chuck it at their head. What's worse and what's more likely to catch someone and concuss them? Wow, that was a stupid analogy. I'm not sure where I pulled that out from. I will never use that to explain anything I think ever again. I apologise to...everyone. Everyone who ever lived.

 

Uhhhh... Have you never heard of Jimmy Young??

 

George Foreman said the three hardest punchers he fought hit so hard that the power when inside your body even if you block them. What's wrong with that? It's easier to judge punching power if they hit you on the body becuz you can feel the power unlike getting hit on the head.

 

Randall ‘Tex’ Cobb - “The first right he threw missed and landed on my shoulder. It felt like someone had dropped a bowling ball on my shoulder."

 

I get what you're saying. Hand speed, punching power, even things as crucial as proper technique that look nice when you're shadow boxing or hitting the bag are irrelevant if you can't demonstrate it in actual matches to get good results. The Khan vs Leonard example was good.

I think people just enjoy speculating who the biggest hitter is. It's the same reason people watch races or weight lifting competitions. In the grand scheme of things, such activities are not particularly important to humanity overall, but it's a primal, youthful part of our minds that enjoys seeing what our absolute upper limits are and we're suckers for competition (even if it's indirect competition between athletes who we're comparing across eras).

To answer the Maskaev question, no I don't think he was way worse than Norton (although Maskaev was 39). But as I mentioned before, Peter reminds me of big sloppy clubbing guys such as Smith, Brezeale, Tex Cobb, Buddy Baer, etc. Norton actually managed to handle Cobb, Marvis Frazier handled smith, and Norton and Marvis were not noted for their china yet pure skill got them the W's.

I don't see Peter being able to do much better than guys like them in other eras, although it's certainly possible he could land something big and turn the fight around with his punchers chance. To use your looney toons piano example, Peter might always have a chance to catch someone with one of his big obvious ponderous blows. That to me is less about him being some sort of big puncher and more just proving that at HW, you better protect yourself at all times because the punchers chance is higher in that division than anywhere else.

I just don't see the results, eye test, or resume indicating he's significantly above the likes of Wladmir or even Rahman for that matter in spite of what Toney said. Rahman at least has scalps over Lennox and Sanders.

If Peter was this devastating proverbial piano that could instantly turn lights out and an ATG puncher who simply lacked the skills to deliver the power, he should have a trail of crippled bodies in his record and a highlight reel of devastating KOs. I mean, wilder, shavers, even Shannon Briggs have them. Peter fought plenty of bums and journeymen to boost his numbers yet he doesn't look as impressive even with low tier opposition.

 

This is very true. The few times I got nailed on the jaw my head buzzed and I couldn't accurately judge the power in the moment.

But those vicious shots to the arms, shoulders, stomach, that really gives you a better idea of a guy's power since there's little chance of that knocking you out, but the pain surges through your body if they're a big enough hitter.

 

To be fair, Caldwell did say Lyle and Foreman hit about the same so he must've tasted his power at some point.

 

He also clarified that Foreman was more of a heavy "booming" bludgeoning puncher whereas Shavers was more "shocking" and explosive. Different punchers.

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the info is good but can only speak for the era or the era before not the future I said this before

dont you find it odd that larry was the only one who said earn hit harder then mike not odd that he could hit harder but to say it like this larry fought both earn and mike
I could say he hit harder then mike but for the whole history I dont know he couldnt say if he hit harder then the other dudes sense he didnt face the others

how do we know if razor or dave hit him that he wouldnt say they hit way harder or a lil harder

from vid I seen people like razor hit harder and caused a stoppage or drop way faster

I never can see razor landing his best punch and ali just taking it like yea it hurt but I can keep my balance ali like I said took 8 clean hard shots and not all he was prepared for never went down or looked like he would

what ali did look like is if earn hit him with a combo then he would fall

 

Yes, but if somebody already believes that ANOTHER 70s or 80s heavyweight (like Foreman, Tyson, Cooney) is a harder hitter than the 90s guys, then the quotes don't need to compare Shavers to future heavyweights. They only need to compare him to Foreman/Cooney/Tyson.

 

When you get hit extremely hard, your brain doesn't instantly refer to a comparison chart and spin out a winner.

At best, you might know you have been struck harder than you have before that point and this sensation will register and stick in the memory.

That this memory, amongst a group of boxers, from a given era (and across eras) seems to commonly bring up the name Earnie Shavers, isn't exactly definitive, but is testament enough, I suppose.

That we don't see this common testimony in any other era is an indicator that Earnie stood out.

Testimony or the lack therefore is more useful than gauging how hard a shot landed, on film. This really is a guess.

All of that said, I'm not sure how one would distinguish between the respective Hail Mary shots from Shavers, Lyle, Foreman and Tyson, anyway.

Just living to tell the tale would be the story there, I suspect.

 

that doesn't work though cause it's still only 1 man cant speak for the whole era that is crazy to think that works that way

earn was the hardest hitting for 70s-30 not the 80s-00s which you keep mixing him in that he couldnt drop ali joe did a man known to hit way less hard then earn does that mean that joe punches had more effect which hurt ali chin way more I think it does

a man doesn't take 8 clean hard shots from the man who was a god at power named earn unless the man power wasnt god like like it is talked of which means earn

I said yesterday which you skipped over that ali was the best mover in defense and speed you know for a fact that he is no longer that I have seen mutiple people who had defense and who have moved more effective with speed

ali never said joe hit real hard yet looking at his Match with joe I know his jaw/chin was more sore afterwards cause of the tech of joe