Emile Griffith vs. Roberto Duran at 147

Duran by decision ...

 

Rodriguez? Seemed to handle Emile in this regard pretty well.

 

Griffith by decision

 

You bring that up a lot. I think he more or less just matched up with Tiger very well. I don't think he proved his strength at WW the way you seem to think at all. He was more of a pure out-boxer with very good inside skills than a physically imposing fighter. Very strong, no doubt, but hardly in the discussion of fighters I'd consider among the strongest. Again, when did he prove that kind of strength outside of the Tiger bout, when he more or less stuck to his old stick and move strategy interspersed with moments of clinching and in-fighting? And when did he prove it at WW? I think for sure a guy like Carmen Basilio was stronger.

 

Maybe the Paret fights?

Benny seemed like a pretty strong, no bull**** kind of fighter.

Though I have only watched their second fight two or three times...dont like watching the ones with the sad endings.

 

Basilio is a good shout. But then, Duran was very, very strong at this weight too, despite coming up. The Palomino fight is a good example. I'd have to say Basilio would shade it, but who would win a Welterweight fight between the two?

 

I don't think he did match strength with Tiger. I think he was able to hold his own in certain inside exchanges and clinches before Tiger really had a chance to get his feet underneath him and really impose himself. It was an excellent, if very simple, gameplan that Emile often used. For the most part, he just stuck to his typical stick and move behind the jab strategy. Were he to have fought with Tiger for prolonged periods on the inside (A prime Tiger, mind you. Remember he never got within 5 pounds of making the MW limit again) I might agree. As it is, he didn't and I don't think he could.

When you factor in that he simply did not show the kind of strength that you seem to think he posessed in any other bout (in fact he seemed out-muscled by the likes of Luis Rodriguez), it just doesn't add up. I don't think he was any stronger than Duran as a matter of fact, and definitely not as varied or skilled.

 

A very real possibility. Griffith must've been tripped up for about a 4 fight period against Rodriguez.:hey

Tiger was always able to impose his strength against men who stood their ground with him, otherwise it took him a minute to get his bearings and really start to impose himself. He was a very patient fighter anywhere in the ring, including the inside. Were Griffith to have stood his ground for prolonged periods, as I stated above, it would've proved that he could match strength with a fading Dick Tiger. He didn't do that, so he didn't prove it. He executed a very well laid out gameplan in the first fight (and still arguably lost because he wasn't able to deal with Tiger's strength and fury as well as you seem to think) and beat a shell of the same fighter in the rematch, mostly by boxing him from afar.

Sorry, I just don't see where you're coming from.

 

Goddamnit! Why? Why did you have to drag me into an increasingly lengthy debate at 11:00 in the morning, immediately after getting home from a drunken bash? I realize you're probably at work with **** all to do, but I'm off today and somewhat hungover. I'm unshowered and unshaven, completely unfit for lengthy debates on the internet. Just little quips will suffice for now.

We'll finish this later.