England's best ever boxer?

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by NoChin, Feb 4, 2024.



  1. DirtyDan

    DirtyDan Worst Poster of 2015 Full Member

    10,391
    3,284
    Oct 30, 2011
    I mean, Jamaica is 92 percent West African with Akan roots and has been like that for nearly 300 years since the original inhabitants the Taino Indian were wiped off by the Spaniards during the exploration to the New World. Jamaica and its people have over 400 years of history, nearly the entire population has West African blood.
     
  2. Brighton bomber

    Brighton bomber Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

    29,399
    25,149
    Apr 4, 2005
    What facts that he moved to Canada? How does that strip him of his British citizenship?

    Him being of Jamaican descent, again how does that strip him of British citizenship?

    That he now lives in the US and again how does that strip him of his British citizenship?

    Those are not facts, they are reasons you have used to form an opinion that means he doesn't qualify him as British in your opinion.

    Lewis is a British citizen, with a British passport who calls himself British in part. Those are facts. Do you understand the difference between opinions and facts? Apparently not.
     
  3. DirtyDan

    DirtyDan Worst Poster of 2015 Full Member

    10,391
    3,284
    Oct 30, 2011
    You seem to be going around in circles, I'm tired of talking about the same thing over and over again. I'll try to dumb it down for you as best I can.

    You seem to think just having citizenship in a country automatically makes them a true citizen compared to someone raised most of their life in that said country and that has adopted the culture. Lennox Lewis was raised and spent the most important years of his life in Canada, that's where he became a man, lost his virginity, chose his profession and learned everything he needed to in life. He could of represented Britain in the Olympic games due to having citizenship there but choose not to not once but twice. He then decides to go back to England to milk money from the gullible English fans with the thickest North American accent I've ever heard.

    Do you know who 21 Savage is? He's a rapper from Atlanta born in London. Do you consider 21 Savage a true Briton and classify him as one of the best rappers out of England simply because he has a British passport while having that ****ed up and weird country ass Atlanta accent? My cousin lived in Japan for nearly 10 years and has Japanese citizenship despite barely speaking Japanese, he damn sure isn't a true Japanese citizen and culturally is still American. Tell me, besides Lewis's passport, what exactly makes him British?
     
    ForemanJab likes this.
  4. Brighton bomber

    Brighton bomber Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

    29,399
    25,149
    Apr 4, 2005
    Here you go again with this "True" citizen BS. Either you are a citizen of a country or you are not. In Lewis' case he's a Brit and Canadian as he holds citizenship with both. Fact not opinion, not some ambiguous term like "True Brit" which has no real definition, even you yourself proved that with your flawed Fitzsimmons comparison.

    You've chosen not to recognise Lewis' British citizenship and that fine as it's your opinion but again it's only an opinion and your attempts to distinguish a citizen from a "true" citizen borders on racism. I mean who are you to question someone's legal citizenship?

    As for Lewis' was he not also raised in England, 12 years there, was bullied in Canada because of his English accent, drinks tea like a Brit eats roast dinners like a Brit too if you check out some of his Facebook posts. Just because he spent his later years in Canada doesn't erase the fact he was also raised British and Jamaican. Again being Canadian doesn't erase his British citizenship or those 12 years as a child where he resided in the UK, but in "your" opinion it does, which is where I and Lewis himself disagrees.

    Also it's unlikely he could have chosen to represent Great Britain even if he had wanted to. If you have represented another country at any time you are required to fulfil some complicated processes to qualify to switch which under IOC rules includes not competing for 3 years for that previous country. Lewis would have basically barred himself from competing internationally and even then the IOC might not have approved his request. So his choice was go to the Olympics in 84 as a Canadian as he had already represented Canada in 83 at the Canada Winter games and World championships or not go to the Olympics at all. Not much of a choice really.

    21 Savage, never heard of him but just googled him, he only gained his US citizenship a few months ago as he was an illegal migrant to the US before that. He's now British and American. Yes culturally he is American more so than British as migrated there when only 7 years old but he's still British and now American. But again you'd say he's not a "True Brit" again using an ambiguous term to support your opinion. As if being exposed to another culture somehow pollutes or invalidates your citizenship.

    All you are doing here is arguing an opinion while using ambiguous terms like "True Brit" which cannot be defined to support your point of view and not doing a very good job at it if I'm honest. I accept it's your opinion and your entitled to it but fact are that many would not agree with you, Lewis himself doesn't agree with you, neither does British law or the boxing authorities that allowed him to compete as a professional boxer as a Brit. Buy hey lets ignore all that and just go with your "opinion" lol.
     
    MarkusFlorez99 likes this.
  5. DirtyDan

    DirtyDan Worst Poster of 2015 Full Member

    10,391
    3,284
    Oct 30, 2011
    Calling me racist, I mean really? :lol: Jesus, what a sensitive little man you are. We'll just agree to disagree and leave it at that.

    This content is protected

    The GOAT British rapper.
     
  6. Brighton bomber

    Brighton bomber Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

    29,399
    25,149
    Apr 4, 2005
    I never said you we're racist for the record, simply just stated my that using terms like "True Brit" borders on being racist, again there's a distinction there you've again failed to discern and I'm not the only one in this thread that has brought up that your opinion has a "sinister undertone".

    But I get it your American you guys are far more sensitive to race and racism than the UK. Which in the end is where I think our views differ, you're looking at this as an American and somehow think that relates to how Brits like myself and others in this thread should view this topic. Me personally I find that kind of arrogant to question another person's nationality, even more so if you are not even of that nationality yourself, it would be like me going to the US and telling some Mexican/American who was born in America that he's not really American is he, as if I had a clue what it meant to be American. I mean due you even understand British culture, clearly not given your view on this topic.
     
  7. DirtyDan

    DirtyDan Worst Poster of 2015 Full Member

    10,391
    3,284
    Oct 30, 2011
    I'll be honest, I don't know nor will I ever see you in my lifetime but you scream insecurity. It's like you're waving your hands to me saying "look I'm British, accept what I am!!!!" It's like you think my opinion invalidates you or people like you from being true British citizens. :lol: I don't give a **** bro, I mean seriously I really don't.

    The fact that you think I'm "sensitive" about race and obsessed with it despite you being the one that keeps bringing it up is weird as ****. Then you have the nerve to generalize my entire country with a negative stereotype which truly borders on racism or at the very least nationalism, but I'll let it slide like a true thick skinned American.

    I'm an extremely non biased and most of all a non sensitive human being. I wouldn't think it arrogant of you at all if you didn't think a certain American fighter isn't American, i'd in fact welcome your opinion. I suppose that's the difference between me and you.
     
  8. AdamT

    AdamT Boxing Addict Full Member

    3,018
    4,712
    Sep 18, 2019
    This will be lost on many lol
    Should have posted the video
     
    Power_tek and KINGWILDER like this.
  9. KINGWILDER

    KINGWILDER "Diamond Boy" Full Member

    1,999
    2,830
    May 11, 2023
    Na, instead he got beaten by an MMA fighter in a boxing ring and had to rob him.
     
  10. KINGWILDER

    KINGWILDER "Diamond Boy" Full Member

    1,999
    2,830
    May 11, 2023
    An absolute gem
     
    AdamT likes this.
  11. Brighton bomber

    Brighton bomber Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

    29,399
    25,149
    Apr 4, 2005
    Your repeated attempts to suggest I am sensitive or insecure in any way just comes across as a desperate attempt to undermine me, because you can't undermine my argument as it's based in facts not a poorly thought out opinion like yours. I really honestly don't care if you think Lewis isn't British your opinion has zero merit as it's poorly reasoned and in the end you have no idea what it even means to be British. But please continue educating us Brits on what it means to be British, lol.

    Sensitivity is meaningless in regards to the actual debate we are having. Even if one of us were in some way overly sensitive to the topic being discussed, how does that even alter our views, answer it doesn't. Oh now you care too much about a topic so you're wrong? I've undermined your opinion based on facts, you're trying to undermine mine not by undermining my opinion with facts but by trying to undermine me.

    Honestly at this point you're probably just trolling, thinking you are in some way upsetting me or that I even care what you think. I have no illusions in regard to changing your mind, that simply isn't going to happen as we have two vastly different perspectives on this topic, yours clearly from an American point of view, mine a British point of view, I'm just having a fun time debating with you and countering your poorly reasoned opinions.

    So please continue to educate a Brit on what it means to be British, lol.
     
  12. DirtyDan

    DirtyDan Worst Poster of 2015 Full Member

    10,391
    3,284
    Oct 30, 2011
    There you go again Mr. British man, negatively stereotyping my entire country of 300 million plus people again, now I'm upset. :nusenuse:Thinking about it now though, I guess you're 100% right. An ignorant American like me shouldn't question the knowledge of a true British gentlemen such as yourself, especially when concerning British matters. I guess there's just something special about being a Brit compared to any other country. Perhaps one of these days I might think about getting citizenship of my own and see what being British is truly like. Although I run a risk of permanently damaging my mandibular fortitude, you truly convinced me that that's a risk I'm willing to take.
     
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2024
  13. Brighton bomber

    Brighton bomber Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

    29,399
    25,149
    Apr 4, 2005
    No you're upset, who's sensitive now? I assume that was sarcasm, lol.

    Not special we just have very differing views on race. For example, if my parents emigrated to the US instead of the UK in the 60's, I would be American but call myself Asian/American or an ABC, American born Chinese. Here in the UK though nobody in my position calls themselves Chinese/British, I'm just British when asked my nationality. You put greater emphasis on your ethnicity than we do. While of course it's still important here as regards to identity, just not on the level it is in the US.

    As I said before I wouldn't attempt to tell you what American means but you seem to have no problem telling Brits what it means to be British if anyone is "Special" it's you as your the one here trying to convince me your American views on being British is the correct one. So please explain to me what makes your American views on Britishness so special that it supersedes my actual Britishness.
     
  14. cuchulain

    cuchulain VIP Member Full Member

    33,447
    8,478
    Jan 6, 2007

    Fitzsimmons would definitely rank higher overall than Lennox.

    The argument regarding one or other of them not being English is a different question.


    Lennox is probably the best 'English' boxer who boxed during any portion of the lifetime of anyone anywhere alive today.

    And the game is very different today from what it was in Bob's day.

    I'm fine with the honour going to the Pugilist Specialist.
     
  15. Limerickbox

    Limerickbox Boxing Junkie Full Member

    12,005
    3,987
    Jul 18, 2015
    For a lot of English people, its not even the immigrant part, so much as that he competed in the olympics as a Canadian