Evander Holyfield vs Prime Foreman?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by KeedCubano, Sep 21, 2020.

Who Wins and How?

  1. Holyfield PTS

    10.9%
  2. Foreman PTS

    2.2%
  3. Holyfield KO

    10.9%
  4. Foreman KO

    73.9%
  5. Draw/Can't Decide

    2.2%
  1. Arminius1

    Arminius1 Member Full Member

    211
    165
    Sportsbook:
    1,000
    Jun 7, 2019
    I will just add the Holyfield had, something young George likely did not have, and that is an indomitable will.
     
  2. Man_Machine

    Man_Machine Boxing Addict Full Member

    5,445
    3,832
    Sportsbook:
    1,000
    Jun 9, 2010
    :lol:
     
  3. Man_Machine

    Man_Machine Boxing Addict Full Member

    5,445
    3,832
    Sportsbook:
    1,000
    Jun 9, 2010
    Did Foreman ever quit?
     
    Flash24 likes this.
  4. Arminius1

    Arminius1 Member Full Member

    211
    165
    Sportsbook:
    1,000
    Jun 7, 2019
    He seemed at times like against Jimmy Young that he lacked enthusiasm.
     
  5. Glass City Cobra

    Glass City Cobra Boxing Addict Full Member

    3,399
    4,941
    Sportsbook:
    1,000
    Jan 6, 2017
    You're the dummy who said Foreman can't land body shots on short opponents so you might want to stop talking!
     
  6. sauhund II

    sauhund II Well-Known Member Full Member

    2,863
    1,369
    Sportsbook:
    1,000
    Nov 8, 2008
    In this fantasy matches big bad super Monster Jorge Foreman ices everybody, of course he was only prime for 2 fights against two good but chinny fighters, one of them pulled off the biggest feast of his career by beating a diminished Ali but went 1-4 afterwards in his signature fights, same with the other guy, after getting rolled by Foreman he actually did better and beat a cement feet Ali.

    In real live Foreman actually lost.....what a surprise, this so called baddest puncher and strongest fighter that ever lived got beat.....he was clowned by a old Ali while barely winning a couple of rounds........clowned by pillow fist Young and went life and death with crude face first slugger Lyle who lost most of his fights when he stepped up....

    Holyfield wanted to KO the old fossil in their actual fight and made it unnecessarily more competitive in giving Foreman to land a blow here and there, in the end Foreman had to wear sunglasses for two weeks hiding his grotesque swollen eyes and face.

    Holyfields hand speed will make the difference while beating no head movement foreman to the punch similar to Ali, has the chin to survive a big hit and the ability to fire right back, all he has to do is to be somehow disciplined for the first 5 rounds and then while no conditioning wonder himself has way more in the tank then a late round Foreman, he can brawl then and most likely would against a weak Foreman forcing a clear UD while scoring a knock down.
     
    Johnny_B likes this.
  7. Man_Machine

    Man_Machine Boxing Addict Full Member

    5,445
    3,832
    Sportsbook:
    1,000
    Jun 9, 2010
    Of course he did. That's why that fight was named
    This content is protected
    This content is protected
    and Round 12 of the same was named
    This content is protected
    (1977).

    That's why, post-fight, Foreman was deemed to be suffering from dehydration and hallucinating, due to the extreme heat that night.

    Although, these are not the signs of what I would normally associate with a boxer who had fought without enthusiasm.
     
  8. Johnny_B

    Johnny_B Well-Known Member Full Member

    1,875
    1,040
    Sportsbook:
    1,000
    Feb 8, 2020
    Go back and read what I said.
    I said: "But you people don't seem to understand how boxing works if you think Foreman can hit Holyfield with body shots"
    I wasn't talking about any bum, but about Holyfield.
     
  9. Johnny_B

    Johnny_B Well-Known Member Full Member

    1,875
    1,040
    Sportsbook:
    1,000
    Feb 8, 2020
    Great post.
     
  10. Arminius1

    Arminius1 Member Full Member

    211
    165
    Sportsbook:
    1,000
    Jun 7, 2019
    Young hadn't apparently suffered from dehydration though.
     
  11. Mod-Mania

    Mod-Mania Boxing Addict Full Member

    3,281
    1,473
    Sportsbook:
    1,000
    Aug 12, 2012
    Foreman late stoppage IMO.
     
  12. Glass City Cobra

    Glass City Cobra Boxing Addict Full Member

    3,399
    4,941
    Sportsbook:
    1,000
    Jan 6, 2017
    I did go back and read what you wrote. It doesn't mame any sense.

    You claim Foreman, a guy measured between 6'3-6'4 would have a hard time landing body shots on a guy whose measurrd at 6'1-6'2. You claimed it's difficult for taller fighters to land on shorter opponents.

    I provided multiple examples of Foreman having no trouble at all landing on opponents even shorter than Holyfield. Ergo, your argument is invalid.

    You claimed a prime Foreman would be too slow to consistently land on Holyfield even though a slow fat old version of Foreman consistently landed on Holyfield. Obviously 70's Foreman is much faster than his older self.

    Ergo, your argument makes no ****ing sense at all.

    It's not like Holyfield was some defensive wizard either, he got nailed by the plodding Bowe, got dropped by Bert Cooper who wasn't particularly skilled by any stretch of the imagination, etc. And Ali was much faster than Holyfield and still couldn't avoid all the body shots despite being much better at rolling with punches to minimize damage. Holyfield did not hesitate to slug it out even when badly hurt, this is on film and obvious.

    You simply don't know what you're talking about. You claim Rahman and McCall hit harder than Shavers and that Lewis had a better chin than Ali. You claim to be good enough to beat past heavyweight champions with zero professional or amateur fights or even footage of you doing bag work.

    Just stop. You're a joke.
     
  13. Eddie Ezzard

    Eddie Ezzard Well-Known Member Full Member

    1,986
    1,965
    Sportsbook:
    1,000
    Jan 19, 2016
    So much wrong with this post, Johnny, I barely know where to begin.

    First off, Ali's chin is not vastly overrated. And I am talking Ali, not Cassius Clay, as it got better as he got older and withstood huge shots from Foreman, Frazier, Lyle, Shavers, Norton and others in the 70s and went down once, for a total of maybe three seconds. That is a concrete chin. Not up for debate.

    Secondly. I have no idea why you should think Foreman couldn't land body shots on Holyfield, You seem to think it's because he's taller. Riddick Bowe was taller than Holy. He had no problems landing to the body.

    He didn't need to kneel or crouch - he would have just bent his left knee a little bit and dipped to the side, no different to what he would have had to do to throw a hook to the head or a straight right.

    Not heavyweights but case in point . Hearns knocked Duran down twice in the first round; once from a body shot and once from a straight right. Watch how he bends his knee both times. There's very little difference. There was no kneeling or crouching.

    You say it's hard to land a body shot if you're kneeling or crouching. No ****, Sherlock. It would be hard to throw any punches if you're kneeling. Not least because the ref would have sent your opponent to a neutral corner while he stood between you counting.

    You're right in that Holyfield wouldn't lean back but that wouldn't preclude George landing to the body. If Evander stands up straight, his body is there for hitting once George corners him or traps him on the ropes. If he bends at the waist, he'll be in the line of uppercuts so he will soon straighten up where he will be open to be hit by body shots.

    Boxers who are not tall are the best at landing body shots, you say. Here's some names. Hearns, Arguello, Saddler, McLellan, McCallum. What have they got in common? Could it be that they were all devastating body punchers? Or could it be that they were all very tall for the weights they operated at? Either or, in case you're wondering.

    I think you need to go a bit easy on decrying fellow posters. A bit less of the 'you people don't seem to understand how boxing works' until you can make a post less full of holes than the one you just did.

    I thought you not only boxed but to a standard that would have seen you be heavyweight champion of the world in another time. How come you seem to know so little about the mechanics of the sport?
     
  14. Johnny_B

    Johnny_B Well-Known Member Full Member

    1,875
    1,040
    Sportsbook:
    1,000
    Feb 8, 2020
    Not just on any guy, on Holyfield, who was more skilled than him.


    No it isn't. Your argument is stupid. If I show you an example of say Hearns knocking out a bum HW, does that mean that Hearns can KO a HW champ ?!? Of course not.
    In my post, I specifically said Holyfield, not that Foreman could not land on any short guy. If the guy is a bum, of course he can land.
    Holyfield is no bum.

    Bowe was more skilled than Foreman.

    Plenty hit harder than Shavers. Shavers is overrated.
    And there is no proof Lewis's chin is worse than Ali's.
     
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2020
  15. Johnny_B

    Johnny_B Well-Known Member Full Member

    1,875
    1,040
    Sportsbook:
    1,000
    Feb 8, 2020
    You are right, I exaggerated a bit, but I just don't see Foreman as being skilled enough to do that to Holy
     
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2020