Explain the Ducking History of Great Fighters Part I: Roy Jones

What belt did Collins hold at Smw wbo ?

Jones held the Ibf I dont see why they couldn't fight when they were both champs ?

You cant deny that had Collins beaten Reggie it would have gave him more leverage how else do you think Reggie got a shot because of his belt and a win over Guthrie? Having Collins on your resume def helped him get that fight.

 

Dam shame he never fought Calzaghe that would have really been a great measuring stick for both guys as to see where they were at and to possible have met Roy around that time ..


I was aware that their fight took place prior to Roy going up to LHW but considering wher Reggie ended up having had a win over him would have given him that leverage ..But then again at the time like you said he didn't have the most steller of resumes so tha didn't help his case ..

 

KillSomething,

There is no mental gymnastics.

You have been shown proof that certain fights couldn't be made.

So now Roy went to Atlanta to meet Evander, KNOWING that he wouldn't get the fight?

The only evidence you have that Roy ducked 12 guys, is simply that he never fought them.

Guess what? That's not evidence.

You want to talk about logic?

Roy was scared of Nunn and Collins, yet fought Toney, Hopkins, Ruiz, Tarver and Calzaghe etc?

STOP with the biased BS.

How is it when I ask you questions, you give me reasons, yet when you ask me questions, you say I answer with excuses?

Every fighter has a different set of circumstances surrounding them.

Joe, Carl and Collins had REASONS why those fights didn't happen.

Just like how Roy had reasons why certain fights didn't get made.

You can't give me reasons, then not allow me to give you reasons.


How many times do you need this explaining to you, before it sinks in?

Roy COULD NOT unify at SMW.

So late in 96, his options were to fight Collins, or move up to a STRONGER division.

Do you understand?

If he'd have stayed at SMW, you'd have ripped him.

What do you mean he continued not to unify?

Glen Johnson would never have caused Roy problems when he was prime.

Tarver would have.

Roch and Nunn would have to a certain extent, and Nunn when he was prime would have been a nightmare for him at MW, but I'd still have tipped Roy to have beaten him.

Dariusz was tough and would have caused him a few problems, but I don't think Dariusz could have coped with Roy's speed.

Collins had an iron will, but be realistic, Roy was on another planet. His claim to fame was beating Eubank and Benn. Eubank was a very good fighter, but he was never the same after Watson. Going into the fight with Collins, Eubank was lucky not to have had three defeats on his resume. He admitted that he lost to Schommer and Benn, and he was lucky against Ray Close. But I have to give Collins huge credit for psyching him out. The Benn fights meant nothing. Benn had already retired once, and he was finished. He even had to resort to putting a large sum of money on himself to win, just to motivate himself, because in his own words, he knew he was kind of gone. Collins was an absolute warrior. But he wasn't a great fighter, and Roy had no need to fear a guy with his limited ability.

Again, Ruiz was truly awful to watch. He had a horrible style. But he was a decent HW, and nothing you will say will change that.

Collins: A tough, granit chinned warrior with an iron will, but limited ability at SMW.

Ruiz. A Genuine top 5-10 HW, who was decent, who weighed 226 pounds.


Best wins:

Collins - Eubank, Benn, Seillier and Cummings.

Ruiz - Holyfield, Johnson, Rahman, Golota and Quendo.


The only reasons why you aren't giving Roy credit for Ruiz, is because:

1. You're biased.

2. You didn't like Ruiz's style.

3. Roy didn't fight Lennox.


Fighting Ruiz at 34, was a bigger challenge than fighting Collins at 27.

Go and watch the Collins vs Eubank fights, and then come back and tell me that he'd have troubled Roy at his peak.

An iron will can only take you so far.

I've got an enormous amount of respect for Collins.

But he wasn't good enough to have beaten Roy.

 

To put that much effort into a troll thread is just embarrassing

 

He's been answered on his other thread.

But instead of taking the points on board, he's instead made this thread and then asked the same questions.

 

don't lie failey.

and don't run away by quoting your own posts.

 

Hilarious!

 

failey getting schooled again. normal service is resumed.


good thing he is called failey.

 

atsch

 

Exactly.

Roy would have needed to have a fought 100 times to have satisfied everyone.

Well, everyone but KillSomething.

 

1997:

He would have gotten $1.8m to fight Nunn.

At the time, he'd already contemplated going up to HW for a big money fight, and he only held the WBC title at LHW.


1999:

He got around $2.6m to fight Frazier.

At that point, he held the WBC and the WBA belts, and he was looking to unify against Reggie Johnson afterwards. (which is what ended up happening)


So the circumstances were different.