We're talking about a prime Ali though,Burt. The Cassius Clay who fought Jones and Cooper was still two/three years away from primetime Muhammad Ali.
This. And I think he takes the Clay of the Liston fight, too. Sometime shortly after that, Ali surpasses Charles at heavyweight.
His growth is particularly noticable between the two Liston fights. He was five pounds lighter in the second fight,but looked broader across the shoulders and chest.
It is one thing being a bit more realistic and not being swept away on wave of Ali mythology but it is another thing to take it too far the other way - Charles was amazing yes Ali was off the scale for me - even the 'amazing' scale - but yeah - great fight due to styles
Ali. Faster, stronger, harder puncher, probably smarter, better chin, bigger, huge reach advantage, I would pick him by KO.
Muhammad Ali would stop Charles late on or beat him wide on points, extremely good big man beats extremely good smaller man
Well you know the Charles that fought Marciano ... :nut ... come on ... Ali beats him pretty convincingly ... either a lopsided decision or some form of TKO ..
Of course Ali would be a favorite by virtue of his size advantage, no doubt...But boxing is about styles,and I think that Ezzard Charles had the punching speed and unflappable temperment to offset whatever weight advantage Clay/Ali had...I am talking about the peak Ezzard Charles of 1948 to 1951 when Ezzard was in his prime at 27-30 years of age...This edition of Charles beat the likes of Elmer Ray,Jimmy Bivins, Joe Baksi, Joe Walcott, Joey Maxim, Joe Louis, Lee Oma, Rex Layne,etc in convincing fashion...He was THREE years older and showing signs of being shopworn when he tangled with the prime Rocky Marciano in 1954...Ezz was not the Cincinnati Cobra of old by 1954 against the Brockton Blockbuster, but yet gave a helluva great and courageous performance against Rocky Marciano...Yessir ! Ali who I saw at the FOTC, certainly beat great fighters at his peak, no doubt and should be a favorite because of his size advantage over Charles, but I think Ali would have trouble against a guy like Ezzard Charles of 1948-51, because he never met a fast cutting puncher like the prime Charles who was such a GREAT professional pro. Ask Archie Moore...Another point relevant to styles...Ike Williams, the great punching lightweight of the 1940s lost three bouts to Willie Joyce a great STYLIST who's style negated what Ike Williams threw at him...So I believe that the 1948-51 edition of Ezzard Charles, who was vastly superior to a similar styled Doug Jones, had a fine chance of beating Clay / Ali in a "fantasy" fight...Ezzard was THAT good...
There is no doubt that Ezzard Charles was one of the very best fighters in boxing history, very underrated (until the creation of ESB classic that is) but to favour him over a prime Muhammad Ali in a HW contest is overrating him, styles or not.
BB I said Ali would be the favorite, BUT not all favorites win, as shown in the recent Kentucky Derby, so my hunch tells me that Charles at his best would spring an upset...bb...
I am not overly-impressed by Clay on film. He was the perfect foil to an aging Liston's plodding, concrete feet and overly deliberate attack. Still, he was too skittish. The second fight was an absolute farce and doesn't rate, but by that time, and certainly after, I suspect Ali was just getting better everyday.
