Face facts here people.... Calzaghe's record is no better than B-HOP's..

I'd say Hopkins has faced the better fighters but they were for the most part smaller then him.Where as Joe hasn't faced as good a opposition they were his weightclass.So I would say they were about even as well.

 

On paper here they're fairly even, but Kessler is a better fighter than anyone on Hopkins' list, AND the way Calzaghe handled him was simply awesome. Kessler fought a great fight, made practically no mistakes & would have beaten anyone else at 168lbs that night, including a good few at 175lbs.

Calzaghe will beat Hopkins if they ever fight. Hopkins ends up by the end of the night looking a little like this... :dead

 

Lmao, kessler the ****ing dane better then DLH, Wright, Trinidad or Tarver? Yeah what planet are you living on?

Super middleweight is almost as shitty a division as cruiserweight.

 

This post makes it clear that you aren't to be taken seriously, but I'll respond to it however.

Yes, Mikkel Kessler, at 168, is better than Winky Wright at 170. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see this. Kessler has the better jab, more power, better timing, better stamina, and more speed. Wright is the BIGGER NAME. But at or above 168, Kessler is the BETTER FIGHTER.

Same goes for Kessler and Trinidad. Trinidad, at 160, was a very good fighter who destroyed William Joppy. But otherwise, he wasn't as good as Kessler is at 168. Kessler actually has the superior resume when it comes to these two weight classes. I'm not talking P4P because in that case, Trinidad takes it.

And finally we get to Antonio Tarver. When Tarver lost to Hopkins, he was not better than Kessler. Kessler is stronger, more skilled, better at keeping a distance, faster, and has the better jab. Tarver is the bigger name, but wasn't the better fighter.

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As far as the cruiserweight/super middleweight comment - it's the fighters that make the division, not the division that makes the fighters. Basically, a stupid comment on your part.

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It seems as though you are impressed by big names. While Wright and Tarver are big names, and excellent wins for Hopkins, the Kessler win was better for Calzaghe.

 

What proof do you have of the assertion that Kessler is a better fighter then Wright, Tarver, DLH or trinidad. Despite not facing any opposition that would prove otherwise? Kessler is a young bull, but Calzaghe was toying with him in the last half of the fight, I saw nothing special, he doesnt have a devastating 1 hitter quiter, he looked average at best.

Yes fighters make divisions, and those divisions I named are virtually deviod of top talent. Kessler may have been the 2nd best fighter at supermiddle, but thats not saying much at all really is it?

 

Look at the way Kessler dominated B level opposition (Mundine, Lucas, Andrade, Beyer). He barely lost a single round. Now compare that with Winky Wright's struggle with Sam Soliman and draw with Jermain Taylor. And going on my eye and viewing of many fights, Kessler is better than Tarver for all the reasons I listed. Tarver has struggled with B level fighters, Kessler dominates them.

And a 34 year old, inactive De La Hoya is still very good, but not as good as Mikkel because he lacks the stamina, workrate, speed, jab, and power than Kessler has right now.

You can make a good case for Trinidad though.

Why would being the second best as SMW not be saying much. SMW has more talent and more depth than MW.

 

One thing mate. Robin Reid was in no way hype. I was a big fan of his, at his peak he was WORLD-CLASS. His peak just happened to not last very long.

 

the problem with asking who fought the better B level fighters is, its who fought the better B level fighters lol. There is no way to know what average fighter was worse then the other. We can only go on competition, and Taylor who isnt a bad fighter, is better then any opposition Kessler has faced. Wright has beaten great fighters and had great bouts. Kessler gets whooped his first bout against an A level fighter. And you saying that SMW is better the MW is hilarous. Lacy? Kessler? Manfredy? Compared to Pavlik Taylor, Wright, Please. Kessler flaws became apparent. Calzaghe was basically asking him to land a knockout blow but he was ineffective. Average speed, average power.

 

SMW: Calzaghe, Kessler, Bute, Mundine, Lacy, Froch, Inkin, Brahmer, Andrade, Miranda, Pascal, Green, Tsypko, Berrio, Bika, Zuniga, Beyer

MW: Pavlik, Taylor, Wright, Sturm, Castillejo, Mora, Duddy, Sylvester, Asikainen, Lorenzo, Griffin, Joval, McKart, Gevor, Marquez, Carrera

I would definitely say super middleweight is deeper in its talent pool and has the better top fighter (Calzaghe > Pavlik).

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When you say Wright and Taylor have faced better competition than Kessler, you are 100 percent correct. They have faced the better fighters and beaten great fighters.

But answer this: at 168 (and 175 for the last one), who would win the following matchups now?

Mikkel Kessler vs. Winky Wright
Mikkel Kessler vs. Jermain Taylor
Mikkel Kessler vs. Antonio Tarver

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Kessler doesn't have average speed or average power. Too debunk the "average speed" claim, I suggest you watch the fight with Librado Andrade where he employs great ring generalship and moreover, displays excellent handspeed for a big man, unleashing 4, 5, and 6 punch combinations with precision. To see examples of his power, the Beyer, Lucas, and Green fights are good ones. He doesn't have the power of Kelly Pavlik, but he has above average power.

Kessler did a lot of good things in there against Calzaghe, but Calzaghe's greatness as a fighter is the reason why Kessler was dominated. Calzaghe took his jab away, showed great defense, threw more fluid and faster combinations, and went upstairs and downstairs.

It wasn't a fight such as the Lacy one where you turn off the TV and think "that guy was overrated." This one was a fight in which you had to admit Calzaghe is a great fighter - if it wasn't previously apparent.

Kessler is somewhat one dimensional in the fact that he is not very good inside, does not throw a lot of body punches, and lacks GREAT punch variety. But he is so effective and talented enough to be called an elite fighter. Once Joe leaves 168, I don't see anybody beating Kessler for a long time, until he moves up to 175 in which Chad Dawson could end up beating him if he fufills his own potential.

 

Nope. Im looking at the top 4, and its far and away better then anything in the SMW, in which the only legit fighter is a 35 year old Calzaghe. Even Sturm gave De La Hoya fits. We dont know how great Calzaghe is, since he's never been in a big fight against a top P4P fighter. Pavlik would give Calzaghe fits, he's a better big puncher then Kessler, and is far better at working his jab, against a very fast and very powerful Taylor he proved that. Calzaghe is fast, but he's largely a slap boxer, not much power in those punches. If he showboated like he did against Kessler, against Pavlik, leaving his chin out there, he would be KO'd plain and simple.

Kessler looked weak, plain and simple and he was the younger, supposedly stronger fighter. Calzaghe can do much better. Oh and Kessler would lose all three of those bouts.

 

:roll: :hi:

 

Kessler was the WBC and WBA Super Middleweight champion? How is that not legit.

And while Bute and Mundine aren't legit, Felix Sturm is? Please explain that. And don't bring up the De La Hoya loss - Oscar is a MASSIVE NAME, but above 154, he's extremely limited and not an elite fighter. Because Sturm probably beat him proves he's a decent fighter, but nothing like Calzaghe or Kessler. Imagine what Kessler would do to Oscar?

Sturm recently had a draw with Randy Griffin and was knocked out by Javier Castillejo. He's not a top fighter and definitely not as legit as Calzaghe, Kessler, Bute, Mundine, and Lacy who have been able to win clearly and without controversy against better fighters.

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Speaking about Calzaghe-Pavlik. Pavlik doesn't have the speed, reflexes, timing, and chin of Calzaghe.

He wouldn't land his straight right hand with any regularity because Calzaghe is great defensively and he took away Kessler's right hand beautifully.

Pavlik wouldn't establish a jab either because Calzaghe's southpaw stance, defense, and movement make it nearly impossible to establish a jab. Pavlik was able to establish a very good jab against Taylor because Taylor has defensive liabilities and does not have Calzaghe's ring generalship.

Watch Kessler's fights against Andrade and Beyer. His jab is faster than Pavlik's and more accurate. In no way, shape, or form is Pavlik much better with his jab because he was able to land it consistantly on Jermain Taylor.

And if Calzaghe is a slap boxer, why was he able to hurt Kessler badly with a bodyshot? Why does he have a 70+ percent KO ratio? Why did he stop Byron Mitchell in the second round, Veit in the first, and knock down Chris Eubank? He doesn't dig his shots like Cotto or throw them with the authority of Klitschko, but he can punch.

 

And what are your views on these matchups?

Mikkel Kessler vs. Winky Wright
Mikkel Kessler vs. Jermain Taylor
Mikkel Kessler vs. Antonio Tarver
Mikkel Kessler vs. Felix Sturm

 

Kessler is a much better fighter than Tarver, you also forgot to add in Richie Woodhall for Calzaghe and explain how destructive his wins over Lacy and Mitchell were.

How a fight is won is just as important as the win itself, and you added when Hopkins totally dominated a guy, such as a Johnson and you should have because he's the only guy to dominate and stop Johnson.

Mitchell had been a former linear champion, KO'd Liles and Siaca, was very competitive with all of the other top guys he faced and was robbed against Ottke, Calzaghe was tossing him around like a ragdoll and finished him in two, despited being KD'd in the hailstorm himself.