Fans For Stanley Ketchel

In my top 10 MWs for sure. But I don't think that the MW division that he ruled was as tough as some others here seem to think. I'm not saying it was weak. Papke and Joe Thomas were no pushovers. But the decade that followed Ketchel's reign may have been THE toughest ever. So many quality middleweights were lurking about. If I ever make it to heaven one of the first requests I will make is to see prime Ketchel vs the likes of Greb, Dillon, Darcy, Gibbons, Klaus(the more-seasoned version), Clabby, McGoorty, Smith and all the rest.

Langford? Like some, I am of the opinion that Langford carried Ketchel and would have knocked him out within 5 rounds had he fought with the intention of doing so. That's more a testament to Langford's greatness than any lack of greatness or ability on Ketchel's part. Historically I can't think of a worse opponent for Ketchel at or near his weight than Sam Langford.

But...this is a Ketchel appreciation thread...so I'll tip my cap to the man:hat

 

Probably that last second knockout of Philadelphia Jack O'Brien. He just poleaxed the guy.

 

S, a little sidenote : Several years ago while walking ,I passed a building
on East 23rd st,in NYC. It now rests on the grounds of an old 3 story horse barn where the great Stanley Ketchel,in 1909 deposited Phil Jack O'Briens head in the resin box a few seconds before the final bell. So powerful was that blow to O'Briens jaw, that O'Briens feet left the floor and his head hit the resin box. He was out cold. I recall stopping by that sight, and trying to recapture that moment in time in 1909. EEry feeling.
Aside : Whether Langford went all out or not is questionable in his bout with Ketchel in 1910. There are many writers who claimed that Stanley got the best of the melee. But the fact remains that Ketchel was lighter by 10-14 pounds against the budding light heavyweight Sam Langford for that bout.
Picture a Marvin Hagler going against a Jimmy Bivens or lloyd Marshall ,when Hagler fought. Another thing for what it's worth : Years later at a boxing dinner, Phil Jack O'Brien ,told the brother of the late Ketchel,"Your brother was the greatest fighter who ever lived". Heady words from O'brien who fought both Ketchel and O'Brien, and helped prepare Harry Greb for the Walker fight in 1925. We should not underate Stanley Ketchel. He was the real goods.

 

Sorry, I meant O'Brien fought both Ketchel and Sam Langford ...

 

So you believe that Ketchel could also knock out Rocky Marciano?

 

All time great....natch...

 

I have always thought a lot of Stanley Ketchel...another mean tough guy in the Duran, Dempsey mold...I used to talk a lot to Nat Fleischer and the old guys at Ring Magazine back in the early 70's.....Ketchel in my top 10 ATG middleweights

 

I never heard that. Interesting, mostly because it contradicts something O'Brien had to say about Ketchel another time. That Stan was " a bum distinguished only by the tumultuous but ill-directed ferocity of his assault."

Langford on the other hand, had "A mystic quality and when he appeared upon the scene of combat you knew you were cooked."

I lifted those quotes from Clay Moyle's Langford bio.

I hope his feelings on Ketchel were more along the lines of what you found than what I found. I'd like to think that Jack had a higher regard for Stanley than just "a bum". Kinda disheartening.

 

Surf, I read that opinion many years ago by a famous boxing writer who attended that dinner where O'Brien was introduced to a brother of stanley Ketchel.can't recall the writers name.
If O'Brien said the remark about all Ketchel could do was hit ferociously. So what ? After all,
all Enrico Caruso could do was SING ! I envision Stanley Ketchel as a superior Gerald Mclellan,with twenty round all out stamina...

 

You'll get no disagreements from me. I was just interested in the contradictory statements made by O'Brien. Then again, contradictory statements are nothing new with fighters, eh?

 

BD where did you talk with Nat Fleischer at Ring Mag ?
When I was in the Navy I sent a letter to Nat Fleischer as to giving me advice
for being a cub boxing reporter for the Ring Mag. He graciously replied. Never took his wise advice. Cheers...