Felix Cash vs Austin Williams - June 10 // London

I never said Lennox was the GOAT. Wrong again. Let’s move on.

 

I love quotes by experienced trainers and champions like Steward and Klitschko, especially when they're discussing subjects they aren't emotionally invested in. Because they know a lot more than the average boxing fan about boxing.

Usyk is a great fighter in his own right; the cruiser and southpaw HW GOAT. it wouldn't be a bad loss.

"failed drug testing"

I guess you still believe in santa too. All top athletes are taking drugs and Fury never popped for the Wlad fight or Wilder fights, despite being the B-side.

"2 years on the coke and booze"

Making his comeback even more legendary. How many fighters in boxing history have come back from a low point like that?

 

Quite a few years and unless you are press, I would be confident that I’ve watched more live boxing than you aswell.

Ref the Wilder Olympic bronze with 3 year’s experience stat you threw out, AJ won World Silver and Olympic Gold with pretty much the same.

The 10 consecutive defences were against trail horses.

 

I didn't say you did but unlike those in his time, you think he's a "true great" and many now think he's the GOAT. More think Fury's a true great now than they did of Lewis then, so he's on the right track.

 

Both of us have our opinions, both of us love boxing. Let’s move on and hope that April 29th happens. Intriguing fight.

 

I honestly don’t know anyone who thinks Lennox is the GOAT.

 

"I would be confident that I’ve watched more live boxing than you aswell."

That makes it even sadder.

"AJ won World Silver and Olympic Gold with pretty much the same."

No he didn't. For a start Joshua was gifted gold at home and would have lost in the first round to Savon and in the final to Cammarelle if he'd fought in China or some neutral place, as Wilder did. Wilder won bronze on less than 3 years experience, Joshua was gifted gold on close to 5. And Joshua is a very good fighter in his own right.

"The 10 consecutive defences were against trail horses"

Lewis, Wlad and Joshua were all KO'd by "trial horses" or wide underdogs given next to no chance. I also don't consider top 5 ranked 30-0 Ortiz and lineal champ 27-0 Fury "trial horses".

 

Agree that the AJ gold was shocking. He clearly lost to the Cuban in the 1st round.

 

Many do:

This content is protected

Respected poster @Dubblechin may also be in that category and he argues his case well. But in Lewis's day he wasn't regarded as a "true great", let alone the GOAT. Many boxing fans always think the current era is the worst ever and in 10-20 years time it's a golden age.

 

I would tbh, I’ve seen pretty much everyone box live. If you had, you wouldn’t think Deontay Wilder was elite ffs

 

Based on his performances against common opponents and relative to his contemporaries he is elite (top 4 on ability and accomplishment) and he carries an elite KO threat (news flash: he's not usually trying hard to win rounds). Let's not pretend you can go 1-1 with McCall and Rahman, or 0-1 with Puritty, 0-1 with Sanders and 1-1 with Brewster or 1-1 with Ruiz and A-side Wilder in America isn't a massive threat to you, let alone over 3 fights.

 

He is not elite and never will be. He hasn’t improved much since he windmilled Audley 10 years ago. Again that was another Weatherspoons fighting moment.

 

Whatever you want to say about his pointfighting skills (and even master pointfighter Fury didn't beat him on points in America) he carries an ELITE KO THREAT (his ferocity and unpredictability is a component of that) and can never be counted out of any contest, particularly against suspect chinned heavies like Lewis, Wlad or Joshua.

Wilder did significantly better against

Helenius than Chisora and Whyte

Breazeale than Joshua and Wallin

Fury than Wlad

Stiverne than Joyce

Arreola than Vitali

Duhaupas and Washington than Miller

Scott than Chisora and Ortiz

Firtha than Povetkin and Fury

Liakhovich, Szpilka and Ortiz than Jennings

Manswell than Chagaev

Morales, Liakhovich, Arreola and Ortiz than Ruiz

 

I never knocked his power, but power alone doesn’t cut it to be called an ATG. Ask Shavers.

I can’t believe you are using the example of Wilder doing better in a fight than plodders Chisora and Whyte. Not a sensible debating point.

 

As I've already said Wilder's got far more attributes than power. Shavers was short, vastly inferior amateur pedigree, started boxing 3 years later(!), fought far smaller men than Wilder (and struggled to KO bigger heavies, so Wilder's KO power was on a completely different level), chinny and frequently showed poor stamina. He lost to a number of journeymen, guys Wilder would be pilloried for failing to KO early. And Shavers still blasted out Ellis and Norton in 1, along with the better guys like Holmes who he knocked down heavily.

Chisora gave Vitali and Usyk two of their toughest fights, he and Whyte both went 12 with Helenius and Wilder starched Helenius in 1 going backwards. If you don't think the KO was impressive then cool. Many were so impressed by it they said it wasn't possible, had to be fixed.