Fistful of Razors: Fighters good at intentionally cutting opponents

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by cross_trainer, Nov 26, 2021.

  1. cross_trainer

    cross_trainer Bergeron Avatar Club Full Member

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    Who were the greatest fighters of all time at intentionally, legally cutting their opponents? The guys who knew just how to punch, and where to punch, to cut somebody? And who deliberately cultivated the skill?

    Bonus points if they explicitly talked about it being a strategy they aimed for.
     
  2. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Moore cut a lot of guys, and he worked those cuts remorselessly once he had achieved them. Late in his career he took a series of fights with wrestlers and beat them all on cuts, it was ****ing weird :lol:

    I once did a comparison of the Murderer's Row and how many guys they cut, or were reported to have cut, and I chucked in Moore as well and he cut more than all fo them combined. He cut more guys than Zivic.

    I'm not saying he was cutting people on purpose but he definitely definitely targetted cuts and made them worse and I think that's the difference. I think Moore achieved more cuts that were reportable. I hope that's clear. So I'm not convinced he cut more guys than the murderer's row combined, but more of the cuts he caused (legally or not) were reported by press, which is the only way I'd ever get to hear of them.

    What about Greb?
     
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  3. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    I love Archie Moore.
     
  4. cross_trainer

    cross_trainer Bergeron Avatar Club Full Member

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    :lol:

    Pretty sure there's a subset of professional wrestlers who specialize in intentionally cutting themselves without letting the audience notice, to make their matches look real. If these were pro wrestling shows Moore was doing, perhaps that's a partial explanation?

    Had he existed, he may well have been the kind of fighter who'd intentionally cultivate that kind of skill, so it wouldn't surprise me in the slightest.
     
  5. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Oh, no, this was boxing:lol: I'll check.

    Mike Dibiase (0-1), Sterling Davis (0-1), Roy Shire (0-1), all wrestlers, all stopped on cuts in boxing matches by Archie Moore :lol: I was sure there were a couple more but I had a lot of wine today, I'll maybe check tomorrow.
     
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  6. cross_trainer

    cross_trainer Bergeron Avatar Club Full Member

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    Ha!

    One begins to suspect Moore's perverse sense of humor at work...
     
  7. scartissue

    scartissue Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Orlando Zulueta, the Cuban lightweight, was said to have a great propensity at cutting fighters. The only thing about that was he only had 7 stoppages to his name in over 100 fights. Still, maybe he cut them but it wasn't bad enough to stop the fight. Anyways, a story I read on him was of a fighter getting cut and the referee was so sure Zulueta had a blade in his glove, he called time and gently rubbed his hand over both of the Cuban's gloves. Gently, because he didn't wish to cut himself on the exposed razor. However, there was no razor. He just had the ability of cutting his opponent.
     
  8. Glass City Cobra

    Glass City Cobra Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Ali was seemingly able to aim for a cut, and when he did he was like a sadistic surgeon. If you pause some fights you'll see him looking intently at sensitive areas such as the eyebrow or nose and then leans in taking a swipe.
     
  9. cross_trainer

    cross_trainer Bergeron Avatar Club Full Member

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    Also employed Jhoon Rhee to teach him to corkscrew his punches against the skin at the moment of contact. At least according to Ali himself (and Jhoon Rhee, IIRC.)
     
  10. Glass City Cobra

    Glass City Cobra Boxing Addict Full Member

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    I wonder if the kronk guys got that idea of twisting at the last second from Rhee. My old coach was a kronk fighter and taught me to turn over my jab and aim for just above the eye to really bust up a guy's face and cause swelling and cuts.
     
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  11. jabber74

    jabber74 Member Full Member

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    Yes, I was going to mention him, but then there was your post. I remember reading an article years ago, it was titled, " Orlando Zulueta -The Fighter With Knives In His Gloves". He said he never understood why he cut so many people, just that he said "I guess I just wanted to win so badly, I fought so hard I cut people" or something like that...
     
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  12. Saintpat

    Saintpat Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    He would twist his jab left and right, at various times, as the leather made contact — violent, sudden twists. And learned how to carve guys up like a Thanksgiving turkey.

    As The Who sang in Pinball Wizard, “such a subtle wrist.” I don’t think anyone ever mastered this to the level of Ali.
     
  13. scartissue

    scartissue Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Jabber, that had to be the same article I saw that in. It was a good piece.
     
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  14. Mike Cannon

    Mike Cannon Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Curtis " Hatchet Man " Shepard, is he hiding in plain sight ? keep well.