Five Frazier Missed As Champ

Ugg.
Ali retired in 1970 to clear the way for a Frazier Ellis bout to determine the new champion. So yes if Ali never fought again Frazier would be the new worlds hwt champion....the most coveted title in all sports that cannot be taken away except in the ring or upon retirement. Certainly Frazier beating Ali in 71 further cemented his title but he did not need that extra cement.

You cannot be stripped of the worlds title...can't happen. If I hear a fellow boxing fan/historian talk about stripping titles I know I am talking with a light weight. Stripping titles by the corrupt boxing commissions is one reason boxing is sh.. right now and has been for 30 years and it's just getting worse and worse. So NO Fraziers title could NOT be stripped just because he fought Daniels and Sanders. Boxing history is what makes any title meaningful and everyone needs to really understand that concept. By stripping and giving it away you disrupt that history so the title then becomes meaningless.

Frazier did nothing wrong fighting these two and it does not deserve discussion. The boxing public and their dollars always, with rare exceptions, dictate that rightful contenders get their title shot. Frazier fought two ATG..one in 71 and the other in 73..here we are 40 years later starting a debate that has never been an issue before.

 

No. He did not lose his title until he retired in 70. Ali was hwt champion from 64 to 70 first time out. Once Ali officially retired which he did in 70 he then relinquished his world title.

 

Meaningless. As mentioned a boxing champion cannot be stripped of his title. Ali was champion until he retired in 70.

 

This is boxing 101 and I'm amazed I have to post this but here is an exerpt from Alis record via the Cyber Boxing Zone......


1970
Feb 1 -Ali officially retired and vacated the title;
This assured that the winner of the Joe Frazier
vs. Jimmy Ellis "unification" bout would be
considered the undisputed heavyweight champion

 

Correct.

 

I just reinforced it in an attempt (probably futile) to get your pea brain to absorb it.

This was a silly topic to begin with, as pointed out by others calling your topic a "non issue", etc.

You are a nut. :nut

Bye now, nut. :happy

 

Bowe beat Holy to win the worlds championship then lost it back to Holy...that's it. As for the others my expertise is in the hwt division but no true champion can lose his title aside from being beaten or retiring.

 

Forget the alpha BS, Ali was still champion until he retire in 1970. There are only3 ways for a champion to lose there belts in my mind, Gets beaten, retires or dies during his rein. Thats it. Besides, the Alpha boys sure loved stripping fighters if they see a bigger draw there way. Just ask Lewis after he unify, The WBA took there belt out of Lewis's hands and handed it back to Holyfiled, who like it or not, for a while still was a top draw.

 

To be clear, this was McVey's original question. Nothing nasty, very simple and something to create some form of discourse. But I gotta tell you, Andre, Houdini and Yancey took this down a sewer with name-calling and other crap. We're supposed to be adults here, guys. I love Joe Frazier - indeed, I rank him #5 of all-time. But this will always be a stigma with me about Joe that he took off for 2 years while champ. I hold my heroes in high regard but I also hold their feet to the fire. I don't give a pass to Ali for the Evangelista's and the Coopman's and I don't give a pass to Joe Louis for the bum-of-the-month. Heavyweight champions don't get non-titles. The bar is raised on them and I reiterate, "They...don't...get...days...off!"

McVey asked a question and I responded constructively instead of circling the wagons around Joe, that had Joe taken on Ernie Terrell and Floyd Patterson it would have done his legacy some good. If I was Yank Durham I would have steered Joe in this direction. Both fighters had reestablished themselves and were both ranked in the Ring Mag's top ten and were both safe opponents. I believe Joe would have stopped Floyd in 5 and Terrell in 12. Moreover, he would have also achieved some form of match-sharpness with the Foreman fight looming, because, let's face it, he didn't spend a day in the gym for the Stander fight. I'm long-winded because i got pissed how this was going. If there are better options for him at this time, let's hear them. But if it's just defending Joe in this indefensible situation, or name-calling, please guys, just walk away.

 

So your not happy unless Frazier fights the greatest hwt of all time in 1971, fights top 5 greatest and it's hardest puncher in 73 and in-between fights both Patterson and Terrell?

Are you joking?

Every champion fights a soft touch especially after such a hard bout in 71. Frazier nearly red lined after his bout with Ali. Suggest you examine boxing history a bit closer.

Would Frazier be rated higher if he would have beaten Floyd and Earnie instead of Daniels and Stander? I really don't think so and you are asking a bit too much from Joe that was not asked of most other past champions.