Floyd Mayweather vs Ray Leonard...

Laughable.

But if you want to go down that road, we can do it for all of Floyd's wins.

Which are Floyd's best wins?

 

It's called LOGIC.

Wlad K beat Haye at 35-36.

Ali lost to Leon Spinks at the same age.

Wlad is still at the top in his late 30's.

Ali was washed up at that point.

So what does that mean?

Does that mean that Wlad is the better fighter, based on those facts?

No.

It just means he aged better under different circumstances.

You can't do like for like comparisons. Because everyone treads a different path.

If you can't grasp that, it's absolutely pointless in continuing the debate.

Because if we used your logic, Floyd, Marciano and Calzaghe would be classed as three best fighters of all time.

Has Manny accomplished more than any other fighter, because he's won titles in more weight classes?

Always take this point on board - statistics don't allow for circumstances.

 

1. How do you know?

2. You have a guy who could beat a prime Hearns at WW, and Hagler at MW etc, who gets beat by Norris, who himself loses to Brown etc, yet you don't think Ray's age played a factor in the defeat?

 

Do you know how ignorant a statement like that makes you appear?

Did Floyd fight the same guys, at the same point?

No!

So quit with the direct comparisons.

They're just stats with no substance.

If you just look at stats, without allowing for circumstances, and putting things into context, it will appear that Rocky Marciano was the greatest HW of all time, no questions asked, and that Trevor Berbick was better than Muhammad Ali.

 

you're damn right its not close. How does ray beating a shell like Hagler count for anything? Eliminate Hagler. Eliminate Benitez (cuz I never thought much of WIlfred anyways) and what do you have, a welterweight with 3 defenses in one year? A lightweight who jumped two weight classes who dropped 40 pounds?

Floyd's wins in four divisions while Ray's best wins come from one divisions 4 > 1 ;; Floyd > Leonard

 

I was going to give an educated response, but what's the point, when you sign off with 'Ray was just a runner'

?

You're not open to an educated, objective debate.

Why am I even debating with you when you respond with blah, blah, blah, when I say that styles make fights?

Again, throughout this thread, you haven't used logic or allowed for circumstances.

 

that's right, you're too busy spending your days out on the sidewalk when the missions let you out in the morning, then peeing on youself

In your spare time when you can find a spot on the library computer, you post here on ESB before the timer kicks you off

 

I could drop down to your level, and say that Floyd's just looked like **** against a crude slugger, so he'd be easy pickings for Ray etc. But then I'd get, either a clash of styles, or age as a response, which you won't allow me to use in this debate.

It's funny, because not once have I seen you do a breakdown of what you think would have happened between Ray and Floyd.

Your only evidence seems to be what other people did.

1. The chances of Floyd even signing for the fight would have been slim to say the least.

2. Floyd is a safety first fighter, and Ray could match him in every department, and was bigger, stronger, and possessed a lot more power. Also, he had more heart and he wouldn't have given an ounce of respect to Floyd's power at the weight.

So exactly how would Floyd have pulled it off?

Tell me.

Because he certainly wasn't stopping him.

So how would he have accumulated enough points to have won a decision?

He didn't possess the tools that Hearns had to cause as much trouble.

He doesn't fight offensively in the same way that Norris did. So you can't just say 'like Terry did'

So enlighten me.

Because he couldn't pot shot Ray, and just throw a few punches.

Ray would be going at him all night.

What about Hearns?

How do think Floyd would have fared against the Hearns that Ray fought?

 

Good post.

This is why we need to establish at exactly what point the fight would take place.

The reason I mentioned Ray being 25, was because that's how old he was when fought Hearns in 81, and Rooster made references that Floyd would outbox him in the same way.

Realistically, a fantasy match up has to take place either at WW or JMW.

So like you've mentioned, you can only pick the versions of Floyd from those time frames.

You need to tell Rooster that Ray's athleticism had deserted him, because he can't see it.

I agree, I also can't see Floyd losing in that way. Although I can honestly see him losing at some point, because despite his Showtime contract, I honestly think he could fight at 40 +

I respect your opinion on what you think would have happened if Ray and Floyd had fought. :good

 

Anyone who picks Floyd knows nothing about boxing. No way Floyd has the output to out point Ray and no way does he have power to KO him. The only question is would Floyd be able to make it the distance.

 

You're not waving anything in anyone's face, apart from irrelevant stats.

Stats alone don't determine who the best fighters are, otherwise 'The Rock' would be acknowledged by every fan, as the greatest HW of all time.

 

Those four guys were better than ANYONE who Floyd's fought.

He's never beat a true ATG while they were prime.

Hey, Manny's won titles in more weight classes than anyone. So I guess that means he must have achieved more than any other fighter, ever?

Right?

 

WTF are your carrying on about? You are so emotional you have me confused with someone else

Then again Im not obsessed with posting about Terry Norris in a Leonard/Mayweather thread

Yes clearly I am the crazy one.atsch

 

Your an angry little fellow.

Nothing wishful on my part. Im not the invested emotionally either way here. Clearly that`s not the case with you. You get awfully worked up over nothing.

Anyway to the point I made. A prime Welterweight Leonard would/could apply pressure to Mayweather because unlike his fights with Hearns and Duran he isn`t going to have to worry about FM`s power. He can open up and be the aggressor far more easily in a matchup like this than with guys that are a threat to hurt him. If your questioning a 25 year old Ray Leonard conditioning then you are too far gone to bother trying to reach.

I noticed you don`t want to dispute the other points regarding Leonard being bigger, faster and more powerful.

The reality is going to be reality whether you or your girlfriend want to acept it or not.

I did state in my original post that Mayweather would stand a much better chance P4P just not as good at `147.

I guess you were foaming at the mouth too much to notice it.:nut