Floyd Patterson vs Joe Frazier, but Patterson gets six tries

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by cross_trainer, May 5, 2022.

  1. cross_trainer

    cross_trainer Liston was good, but no "Tire Iron" Jones Full Member

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    Patterson is put up against Joe Frazier prime for prime. Six times in a row. Does Patterson win any of them?
     
  2. Zakman

    Zakman ESB's Chinchecker Full Member

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    Patterson's fragile mandible gets shattered every time. Frazier bounces him off the canvas the way Johansson did, before finishing him the way Sonny Liston did.
     
  3. Stiches Yarn

    Stiches Yarn Active Member Full Member

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    Anything can happen you know.
    It is possible for Floyd, who had amazing power for his size, to stop Joe IF he hit him hard enough. but it is more likely that Joe, with the better toughness, stronger chin, greater strength, and hitting even harder, stops him (ALMOST) every single time.
     
  4. Sangria

    Sangria You bleed like Mylee Full Member

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    Amazing fight that I wish had happened. Patterson-Marciano is another that would've been interesting.
     
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  5. Journeyman92

    Journeyman92 Resident Gadfly Full Member

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    This is very interesting, without all the extra tries I think I know how it'd go but I always wonder what would've happened regardless more how it would look rather then the outcome. Bit like a fight with Roberto Duran vs Nigel Benn. It's the aesthetic.
     
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  6. cross_trainer

    cross_trainer Liston was good, but no "Tire Iron" Jones Full Member

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    Agreed.
     
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  7. Fogger

    Fogger Well-Known Member Full Member

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    This is a bad match up for Floyd. I believe Frazier knocks him out so early in each fight that Paterson just won't have enough actual boxing time to figure out a way to survive and thrive.
     
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  8. Journeyman92

    Journeyman92 Resident Gadfly Full Member

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    We do have film of Duran sparring Benn however. It’s cool to just see how they get on but it doesn’t give you the measure of it. James Scott used to spar Ruben Hurricane I’d love to see the videos of those sessions with a developing Scott and an older Ruben.
     
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  9. swagdelfadeel

    swagdelfadeel Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Everyone on ESB: Frazier is such a slow starter.

    Also everyone on ESB: Frazier knocks Patterson out early.
     
  10. MarkusFlorez99

    MarkusFlorez99 Boxing Junkie banned Full Member

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    Patterson has a glass jaw. Even as a slow starter Frazier was smokin china chins like he did Foster
     
  11. Fergy

    Fergy Walking Dead Full Member

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    I'm not seeing Floyd really having much luck in any of his attempts.
    Joe s murderous shots hurt Floyd fast and early.
    Sorry Floyd, but this is an awful match up for yer. Even with six attempts.
     
  12. Journeyman92

    Journeyman92 Resident Gadfly Full Member

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    With all due respect I don’t think Frazier was a slow starter.
     
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  13. bboyrei

    bboyrei Member Full Member

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    He only got branded as a ''slow starter'' due to the Ali fights and when he was knocked down early by Bonavena and Foreman.
     
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  14. Pugguy

    Pugguy Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Well, I don’t think Patterson’s chin was glass. Glass shatters, breaks, irreparably. The Tarver KO of Jones screamed glass.

    No, Floyd’s chin wasn’t fragile like that. No, not great like Ali’s of course but as many times as Floyd did hit the deck, he also got right back nearly as many times per fight to take care of business or at least securely last the distance.

    If you were punching on with Floyd in the street and suddenly Floyd hit the ground but arose almost as quickly to beat the sh*t out of you, I don’t think your overriding sentiment would be that Floyd couldn’t take a shot.

    Aside from generally losing the round in question, a KD is just a KD if it doesn’t directly yield or lead to a KO or consequently cause a severe and detrimental alteration in style and accent - see Camacho v Rosario. When Floyd bounced back up - he still fought as usual, for better or worse, not compromised by the KD.

    But the question of Floyd’s chin is partially mooted in so far as Frazier didn’t need a glass chin in order for Joe to dent it. Joe dented many an excellent and great chin anyway.

    Joe was a relatively slow starter - not protractedly so…but it did take a few rounds for him to start to build up a full head of steam and truly smoke.

    You could actually see this when Joe fought, warming up over the first 1-2 rds - rds he might generally lose - and this perception is further supported by Joe being most often hurt, stunned or KD’d in the very early rounds, when at his most vulnerable - before his bob and weave and offence got into full swing. Ramos and Foster are also another two opponents who stunned Joe in the first few rounds.

    Patterson could try take advantage of the small early rd window to lay some hurt on - perhaps even stun Joe…a KD on the outside. I don’t see Floyd being obliterated per se, certainly not Liston style or even GOAT Super Swede style but Joe’s incessant pressure and punishment output will build and accumulate.

    If it panned out that way, I think Floyd’s good to arise from 2-3 spaced KDs - but that would put him further behind on points let alone considering the effects of the accumulated punishment.

    I’d guess a mid to late rd stoppage for Joe. But then, I could perhaps see Floyd eking out survival to the final bell.

    In a 6 fight series, I could see Floyd improving - just as he did when he broke the shackles from D’Amato, embarking on a steep, post prime learning curve which saw some highly creditable, successes and performances against some very tough opp - Floyd becoming that much more of a gutty fighter atop all else.

    Does the 6 fight series carry forward the damage and wear tear from each preceding fight? If so, that could be problematic for Floyd.

    Otherwise, aside from the retentive features of learning and experience, if it’s a physical refresh each and every time out - that’s better for Floyd - because the initial go arounds with Joe could incur such damage as to put paid to any possible improvements on Floyd’s part for future fights in the series.

    Even just two back to back fights with an absolute prime Frazier could hold the potential for literally wrecking a fighter’s career going forward. Joe was a beast and took no prisoners.
     
    Last edited: May 7, 2022
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  15. he grant

    he grant Historian/Film Maker Full Member

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    Agreed ... ask Bob Foster ... Frazier inside five ..