Floyd Patterson would have sucked in any other era

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by InMemoryofJakeLamotta, Mar 31, 2024.



  1. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    The first thing to understand about the post Tunney era, is that he has a very different career trajectory.

    Thee is no Olympic medal ticket, he is just thrown in at the deep end, as Sharkey was.

    OK. but let's assume that he has clawed his way to his level back then.

    He still probably loses to the best of them, but his form and longevity, most likely make him a problem in the division for a long time.

    There is also the color line issue.

    A smart manager might be trying to keep him at LHW, where John Henry Lewis was getting title shots.
     
    Last edited: Apr 2, 2024
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  2. Melankomas

    Melankomas Prime Jeffries would demolish a grizzly in 2 Full Member

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    I can’t see how it’s a great win if he’s been dominated every other time they met. I guess that’s just how I see it.
     
  3. Kid Bacon

    Kid Bacon All-Time-Fat Full Member

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    Well, Floyd is in good company in such regard. He wouldn't be the first american boxer who somehow was not fully aware of what his european opponent could bring to the ring.

    Louis was kinda surprised by Schmelling and Ali was almost caught by Cooper.
     
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  4. Kid Bacon

    Kid Bacon All-Time-Fat Full Member

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    All I know is Liston, of all people, respected Patterson's boxing skills and courage, and wouldn't allow anybody to diss him in his presence.
     
  5. Kid Bacon

    Kid Bacon All-Time-Fat Full Member

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    Well, maybe "easy" is too strong a word.

    But Joe admitted that somehow he and his team underestimated George and considered him "beatable", regardless how strong and big George was.

    Furthermore, I think to recall Joe was not exactly in top form for that fight. Lets remember that Joe was still riding high from the FOTC and after beating Ali, was considered the undeniable Top Dog.

    Furthermore: Frazier was actually heavily favored by the so called "experts" and bettors. The consensus after the FOTC was that Joe was too tough and resilent to be beaten by a newcomer like Foreman.

    Nowadays it seems like madness, but hindsight is 20/20.
     
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  6. newurban99

    newurban99 Active Member Full Member

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    Where did you read or hear this?
     
  7. newurban99

    newurban99 Active Member Full Member

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    Good SI story. A little overwritten but I like the line about his girlfriend not worrying if Ingo wants to marry or not. That's a coy 1959 way of saying the unmentionable.
     
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  8. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    Name them.
     
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  9. Kid Bacon

    Kid Bacon All-Time-Fat Full Member

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    "A vital clue to who Sonny really was, as a man, was his reaction to the reporters attacking Floyd Patterson for being a coward. Liston was the one man who would have no part of the theory that Patterson was cowardly:

    This content is protected


    Sonny told the reporters Patterson had nothing to be ashamed of, and they should stop what they were saying:
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    "

    John McGlothlin
    This content is protected
     
  10. HistoryZero26

    HistoryZero26 Member Full Member

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    I believe they are talking about subsequent eras and maybe the 30s that ATG conversations at HW tend to revolve around. The era before Pattersons was dominated by bloated LHWs and this is an era he would have done better in.

    And for all those lamenting Patterson being in the wrong weight class his career started in that era. Patterson also said he'd sacrifice being the LHW GOAT to win the HW belt even if he accomplished nothing else at HW. Since Patterson grew up at a time where the same fighters were competing in both classes he'd be more inclined to see LHW as the HW B leagues opposed to a weight class for smaller men.

    Now one would think "how does this prevent Patterson from going down to LHW in 1965 when he was 30?". Patterson had won the HW belt twice so if he lucked into winning it again he would have been the "first three time HW champion" . I think the "2x,3x,4x champion" label is dumb(it rewards losing) but rightly or wrongly this might have been the most prestigious acheivement in the sport. It makes sense Patterson would value it's attainment above anything he could acheive at LHW.
     
  11. HomicideHank

    HomicideHank I believe in the transmigration of souls Full Member

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    Correction-18

    Bonavena
    Machen
    Jones
    Chuvalo
    Mathis
    Ramos
    Bonavena
    Zyglewicz
    Quarry
    Ellis
    Ali
    Foreman
    Bugner
    Ali
    Quarry
    Ellis
    Ali
    Foreman
     
    Last edited: Apr 2, 2024
  12. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    Zyglewicz was not ranked
    Mathis was not rankedi
    Ellis was not ranked second fight.

    That gives you 14, the point being, Patterson's total of top ten ranked fighters faced, compares very favourably with any heavyweight champions .
     
  13. HomicideHank

    HomicideHank I believe in the transmigration of souls Full Member

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    I edited it to 17. I forgot Chuvalo.
    Zygelwicz was ranked in March 1969.
    You didn't specify that the had to be ranked on the day of the fight so as far as I'm concerned they're valid
     
  14. InMemoryofJakeLamotta

    InMemoryofJakeLamotta I have defeated the great Seamus Full Member

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    Never thought of it that way, but when Patterson was a boy, he would have grown up seeing light heavies competing at both light heavyweight and heavyweight. Oftentimes simultaneously. A guy may fight one fight at 175 and then his next fight is at heavyweight. Archie Moore and Bob Satterfield frequently did this.
     
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  15. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    I'm using Ring ratings Ziggy was never ranked by them, and nor should he have been.

    I'm content that I proved my point.
     
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