For my 5,000th post : My Pound-for-Pound Top 50 Fighters of All-Time..

I wasn't really arguing that Hopkins should be above him, far from it. I tend to think they are both too high, and I wouldn't have Hopkins above Hagler by any stretch of the imagination. I found it strange to see Jones 15 places above Hopkins when I've debated that Jones' resume is better with PACFAN before, and I know that PAC places much greater emphasis on resume than any H2H skills. I was just looking for clarification, thats all.

Good list.

 

For me, Ali's talent and h2h ability in the mid-60s allied to his career resume justify his position. He was just so special.

Monzon lost for the 3rd time in his 19th fight, in Argentina in 1964. From then on until his retirement, he never lost again. In this time he went 81 fights undefeated. IMO, he is the greatest middleweight ever h2h (I can't say Greb would beat him h2h due to the lack of footage of Greb) and the greatest of the last 75 years. Middleweight is traditionally one of the strongest divisions in boxing, therefore it would be bizarre to rank the best middleweight in three-quarters of a century far outside the top 10. OK, he was a one-weight champion, but I don't think this should always count against fighters. If their bodies are built for one weight and they can comfortably stay there, I think they should be judged on how good they were at that weight. Don't get me wrong, multiple weight titles is a more impressive feat, but they don't automatically rank higher IMO. Oscar De La Hoya is a 6-weight world champion, but Monzon was so so much better at middleweight than Oscar was at any of those weights, so ability must be considered along with achievement.

Louis and Monzon are 1-weight champions. IMO, Monzon is simply a better middleweight than Joe Louis was a heavyweight, a better fighter pound-for-pound. Louis fought a lot of 'names', but I'm not convinced his resume is better, especially when you consider that for a lot of Louis's quality wins (Walcott, Bivins, Conn etc) that Joe had a 20-40lbs weight advantage.

:good

It is actually neither the Nonpareil nor the Manassa Mauler, I am just a ****** who meant to type Jack Johnson but whose mind was clearly elsewhere.

Billy Conn I must be honest I didn't even consider. Holman Williams was on my shortlist of guys who narrowly failed to make it, that may be an error on my part.

Thank you for your comments McGrain, much appreciated :good

 

Cheers mate :good

 

I will check out your response Cuch as I am interested in reading that, and thanks for the congrats mate :good

 

Lennox Lewis is a significantly greater boxer pound-for-pound than Joe Calzaghe in my opinion. It's not even very close for me.

 

Roy Jones is a special case for me. As I think the 168 RJJ '94-'96 is the greatest h2h fighter in history, that pushes him up my personal rankings. It has to.

 

I take issue with your comments about Calzaghe's resume - I've spoken to you before about this - If you want to discredit the real merits of Joe's resume - you need to apply the same standard across the board - which affects the relative standings of many many fighters.

I mean - who the hell rates Ali? Joe Frazier is 100 times the man he'll ever be!!! :hey

 

I considered Harada for a long time, but left him out in the final draft after much consideration. Perhaps that was wrong, I dunno. Like McGrain pointed out Billy Conn, you have pointed out another hole in my knowledge, as I didn't even think of Dick Tiger.