For one night only:Were Ali and Frazier of the FOTC the 2 best Heavyweights?

I was at ringside at the FOTC, thrilling for sure, but I would wager anything that the peak Joe Louis of the Baer fight would have kod both Clay/Ali or the brave Joe Frazer that night.
Louis was the perfect blend of speed and devastating combinations not equaled by any heavyweight in history...

 

Both would have been very hard to beat on that night.

 

Sorry Burt but I don't see anything Joe had at any time in his career that is going to take away the post Liston up until the forced exile in 67 Ali's flight of foot and speed of hand from range. All Joe's greatest work was delivered from the inside with punches that travelled hardly any distance at all. Plus if he does get inside Ali does what he always did to the shorter lighter man, pulls him downwards by the back of the neck.

Edit.

I'm talking about Joe L, not Joe F.

 

Louis was a different kind of animal, too bad he did not have an Ali or a Frazier in his day. It would have been a great fight with either man and Louis had many tools to bring. I would have loved to see him in a super fight of this magnitude and I would not bet against him.

 

He did have a Schmeling.

I'm not even being cute, Max gets pretty damn underrated.

 

B, people forget, or do not wish to know that the 200 pound Joe Louis was DAMN STRONG. In one instance during his fight with Primo Carnera, Louis from in a clinch lifted Da Preem off his feet
and deposited him a foot away. I am convinced that much of
Ali's vaunted greatness was due to his histrionics in and out of the ring, along with his outgoing personality, has contributed
as much to his legend as his ability IN the ring. The Joe Louis of the Max Baer fight with his triple and powerful left hooks would have sometimes caught up with Ali, hurt him an kod him.
As a famous ringside doctor once opined, "the human body was not made to withstand the blows of Joe Louis, once he had you hurt". AMEN...

 

Ali was 29, but he was far from prime during the FOTC. Frazier was arguably at his best during the FOTC.

Frazier would have still lost 10 out of 10 bouts against Foreman, even on that night.

And Ali would have surely lost to Norton on that night.

 

I feel vindicated by my earlier statement (implying that Max is hardly a much less worthy arch-nemesis than Smokin' Joe) having done a quick search on whether a comparison thread between them (either ATG status or h2h) was ever done. There was a thread made right here on the Classic forum some years back in which the majority did pick Frazier over Schmeling but with the caveat in almost every case that it would be very close and that Schmeling victory would be stupid to rule out. :good

I've also seen him with some regularity in a top 15-20ish spot on ATG lists, whereas Frazier is usually lurking around or just outside ten. So the comparison is no insult to Frazier.

 

Ali/Clay v Louis comfortable 10- 5 or 9-6 in rounds win for the Louisville Lip.

 

The remarkable version of Joe Frazier that night with his swarming style would have played directly into Sonny Listons hands .

Listons pole-like devastating Jab would be Fraziers downfall .

 

Simple answer to this thread - No.

 

No way. Ali was superb that night. He was great. Joe was just relentless. That Ali would have probably stopped Norton.

 

R, I have no axe to grind. But because I grew up in the time when Joe Louis was at his best, seen great films of him so lifelike on the movie newsreels, realized how dominate he was when he
poleaxed his opponents, and like all boxing fans grew to love the Brown Bomber. I also saw Clay for the first time when he won a split decision from Tony Madigan, the Aussie in a 1959 GG bout
and later in the FOTC...And I am convinced that the Joe Louis of the Max Baer ko would have beaten ANY version of Clay/Ali, both at their best. Louis was lie a cobra against Baer, who if needed put together awesome ko punches so fast, accurate and deadly
that Ali never faced amongst any of his opponents...And the Joe Louis of the Max Baer era would have surely kod one of my favorites Billy Conn in an earlier round. Joe Louis for the ages...