For Those Who Have Made A Close Analysis Of Pacquiao/De La Hoya...

I was just watching it before actually. I don't even know where to begin. I noticed right in the first round oscar was not really applying the pressure or coming forward with his jab. The comentator stated "oscar is not really using the Jab. This must because of Pacquiao's side to side head movement"..but PAC wasn't moving much at that stage, and that is totally irrelevant anyway. The jab is a a way to keep a buffer between you and your opponent as you move in. At that stage it was odd viewing, to me anyway, as there was one huge figher and one much smaller fighter going through that 'feeling out' process that happens early on to establish dominance. But you could see by the size of the two that Oscar was the more dominant and surely he must have known that in the ring as well as before getting into it. Compare the first round of Hoya V floyd with the first round of Hoya V PAC. In the former, Hoya came to fight. In the latter, he came to 'box'. Why? Why the tentative fumbling about against a fighter clearly his inferior in size? Was he woried about PAC's power? Maybe.

From there, Oscar never really got into the fight. Manny slowly but surely felt his way in, closing the range, and grew more and more confident as he realised that Oscar was not fighting back. It's been written off as exhausion, weight drain, etc but to me it seemed like intent was absent from the start. What's more, i didn't see him exert himself enough to even get exhausted.

After that, yes pulling punches, as you ponted out. I don't know how many other people think he was doing this but it seemed pretty obvious to me.

Everybody was schocked by the spectacle that ensued after round 6 when Manny was wailing on Oscar like a corpse. Perhaps he was out of legs, but you could see that he mentally capitulated at least 3 rounds before the fight ended, and purposely allowed himself to get beat up. He went into a mode where he wanted to elicit pitty. Maybe this was just because he knew he couldn't win and wanted people to know it wasn't the real him.

Add to all that, the bizarre decision, with no precedent in history as far as I can see, of a fighter moving down in weight (quite a long way, i might add) coming in dramatically under the weigh limit. Nobody has adduced an explanation for this yet.

None of this proves anything. I can also think of reasonable explanations for all these things. But on the weight of evidence, my suspicion is oscar came to lose. Coming in underweight like that gave him an excuse to lose. Nobody would think that was a prime oscar or give meaning to the fight. Being seen as totally shot would lead to people rationalising that he was far from prime when he fought Mayweather - a loss that must really annoy him when he goes to sleep. It would build PAC into a superstar, and build the sport of boxing and the opportunities for golden boy promotions.
Oscars was probaly struggling to find a relevant opponent and thought he would fall on his sword for the good of his legacy and the sport of boxing.

Or perhaps not. People will think what they will. But I smell a rat.

 

i have seen precisely the same things that you have and i personally think something was indeed up. and yes, all of the excuses for oscars showing are bright as day. but, dont fighters only make those kind of excuses if they continue fighting on? why would he want to conclude his illustrious career by purposely having a smaller man knock him out?
he certainly didnt recieve much pity and im sure he hasnt gained a new legion of fans based on his awful showing. too weird when you add it all up. let me watch it again a couple of times to see if i can disprove the conspiracy theory.

 

The Jab will not work against Pacquiao. Its the right. Pac is a lefty, therefore you need a right. If Hatton throws his right more, then he has a chance.

 

Oscar was not himself in the fight with Pac, he was a businessman, part time boxer at that time.

 

Did you find anything? I am not sure and i never will be.

but two more things:

Also I noticed these kind of coreographed 'rallies'. Oscar would all of a sudden look 'angry' and start wildly swinging at air, one or twice every round.

The decision to fight Manny in the first place also makes sense in my half hearted conspiracy theory. Everybody was shocked and appalled when he announced he was fighting PAC. Truley it is hard to imagine what Oscar thought he was getting out of this fight as even if he won, he wouldn't get any credit. But if he intended to lose all along..it makes total sense. Oscar wanted to 'stage' an Ali Foreman type upset to boost the sport.

 

Round 5 HBO Time 0:32

Manny eating 3 clean left hooks as if its nothing much

Round 5 HBO Time 1:59

Manny darting in, using his left to sway off Oscar's glove and unleashing a straight right and then moves out within just 1 second.

 

wned

 

i watched it the other night just for shits and giggles but ever since the suspicion was raised, i just cant seem to look at the fight objectively. each time i watch, i am more and more convinced of it. but i just cant work out a proper angle for oscar to throw it. thats the part that has me totally puzzled.
eh, whatever. it was a pleasure to watch that jerk off get pummeled. he's crooked, no different from the other ringleading promoters.

 

So that vicious KO the other night and you still got your little conspiracy theory?:think

 

:---(

 

jeff, i already told you once. i have no interest discussing
any topic on any day for any reason with you. i have seen
enough of your posts in numerous other threads.





and furthermore, how could you sell out your pac-hating
ways and use an achievement of his in a feeble attempt at
"owning" someone?
i dont wish for a reply, but you should be ashamed.:nono

 

Trying to avoid the question I see. I think your "conspiracy theory" will have to be examined!

 

Oscar's psychology through the whole process was entirely baffy. Even during negotiations, it seemed like money wasn't the issue for him - more that he was earnestly trying to make a point.

Out of all the ideas I've heard for what that point could possibly have been, only one made any kind of sense to me, though it was a really stupid one, if true: He thought that fighting the "Mexicutioner" would endear him to Mexican fans and win a lasting place in their hearts.

Again, that reasoning makes him look completely out of touch with hardcore Mexican fans. The lead-up bluster from him felt to me like a gutted-out version of his talk about reaffirming his legacy as a Mexican fighter by fighting Vargas. Something like that; I haven't bothered to check if my memory's failing me on that.

The whole "I wanted him to knock me out" nonsense leads me to believe that if he couldn't decisively beat Pac, his back-up plan was a lame attempt to 'go out on his shield' like a real Mexican does. :roll:

Then again, his mindset has always baffled me. His eyes during the glove touch in recent years generally looked to me like was pumping up by trying to make himself cry. Maybe it's like what Tyson says worked for himself: that tapping into childhood fears or failing his 'legacy' was the strongest motivator he had. It's not like Pac would have any interest in insulting Hoya and get under his skin, which he may have been blind enough to believe would happen.

 

:rofl