Frank Warren was asked the difference between now and when he first started....

There's defo a case of

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on this forum, but c'mon........

Haye vs Liston ?? WTF :rofl

 

No? The guys in the 50's fought when there was a far deeper talent pool.

Trust me, on average, you'd lose money on a 1950s vs. 2000s bet.

 

They dont do this too often in the 2000's

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=81non05aKX4[/ame]

 

Its not just about fighting more often (although that must help on the technical side) its that there were far more active boxers back then. More competition usually means better competitors.

 

If boxers are fitter now why are they fighting shorter distances and wearing bigger gloves ?

I mean, they might be fitter but they aren't allowed the opportunity to show it.
They are not allowed to take the punishment that fighters of decades ago proved they could take, in the gruelling 15 and 20 round title distances of the past, so what's the point of them being fitter ?

I look at the likes of Tyson Fury and Danny Williams and others are wonder how they'd do in the domestic scene in the 80s, 70s and before. They certainly wouldn't have cut figures of being the best-conditioned. And some of Fury's opponents make Don Cockell look anorexic.
I don't think Derek Chisora is as fit as Horace Notice, nevermind fitter.

In the 70s heavyweights were 15 stone and could bounce around for 10 or 15 rounds. British title fights were 15 rounds.

Frank Warren started out being associated with the likes of Lenny McLean, unlicensed fat hard men and fourth-rate fighters. Now he gets the pick of the best fighters in the country. It's no surprise he thinks the newer fighters are fitter.

People can talk about progress and improvement all they want. I'd just say I'd like the fighters to prove that. When I see them fighting 15 or more rounds at a fast pace, and see 15 and 16 stone heavyweights doing more than just plodding and hugging, and see flyweights having 15 round wars with 6 ounce gloves, they we can have some sort of discussion about superior fitness.
At the moment there is absolutely no basis for the claims.

Fitness for boxing needs to be demonstrated in the boxing ring environment.

 

Boxing is actually mostly mental, its about making the right moves at the right moments and anticipating what the other guy is going to do. And there are thousands of moves to choose from, and an thousands of moves to be anticipated.
It takes practice and a certain type of intelligence.
I don't think any sports science or any type of science has come up with a way to improve that intelligence. It's something good boxers figure out themselves, and good coaches help them get in that zone.

I don't think running, swimming, cycling etc. have that same aspect at all. It's basically clear before the race starts that the only way to win is to be fastest over the course. Mistakes can be made in pacing, but that's about it. In boxing, it's not known what precise moves will play out at all, whether mistakes will be made, or capitalised on, what feints and punches and blocks will be the best ones at any given time in the fight.

 

How is it?

Fighters today aren't fighting 20 times a year in 15-20 round fights, nor are they typically sparring as much.

 

Ah, but their computerised body fat measurements are down....

 

You ask people who have been around in boxing even longer than that and a lot will say the sport has regressed technically over the years.

 

I thought me saying you've got it all wrong would've made that clear to you. LISTON IS NATURALLY A HELL OF A LOT STRONGER. I dont even class haye as strong, thats why he does'nt do close quarters and stands off to land his punches. Hell even haye himself admits he's not a fighter that can stand toe to toe .....

 

Rugby and football are team sports, and cannot be compared to boxing. Rugby wasn't even a professional sport back in the 1970s !

I think Borg, McEnroe and Lendl and Navratilova would do okay in tennis today. Sure, they'd be up against some stronger opposition but they were remarkably fit and capable in their own right. They might take a few games to adjust to faster serves but they'd cope and would be among the elite.

Muhammad Ali was faster than the Klitschkos and Haye, and when he was tip-top he was fit to dance for 15 rounds and throw blinding combos until the final bell. Even if Klits are bigger and stronger, that's about it. Haye isn't even that. Would Haye crush Ali ? Would Wladimir crush Ali ?

Carlos Monzon. Dick Tiger. Marvin Hagler. Those were strong, fit, middleweights. Do you think today's middleweights would crush them ?