frazier fotc 1971 vs foreman 73.

Can't Handle the heat get out of the kitchen. Frazier beating prime Foreman? A joke and no one who knows boxing living through that time period would think differently. Next thing you will be telling me is prime Wiilard would have beaten Dempsey.

You THINK Foreman was winning those rounds? Llololollolol

 

Its not the heat, your cooking just smells like ****...bull****.

 

Truth hurts. Foreman always being able to beat Frazier is boxing 101. It's akin to walking into a room of boxing historians and saying prime Willard would beat Dempsey. You would be laughed out of town! Sorry but it's a fact. Why don't you know this? Were you around during that time period? New to boxing?

 

Agree. This Joe was just not in the condition to fight especially because of the bad vision and coming off the Manilla war. Surprising that Joe did what he did knowing where he was at that point and being that out of peak condition. George was starting to get winded after that second knockdown.

 

You have not watched the fights and you dare even to talk about either fighter?

On YouTube Ali is interviewed as he watches the bout by Cosell. First round starts and there is where Ali states he did not expect Foreman to be as fast as he was. Do some research.

Boxing 101 you are talking about but that don't work if you can only fight one way effectively and your opponent has every physical advantage over you and can ko you with every punch he throws. Foreman manhandled Joe like he was a child.

Sure....Frazier from 71 never gets hit and stops George....right! Complete reversal after fighting two fights being kd eight times, teeth knocked out, mouth pouring blood and staggering all over the ring. You have a vivid imagination.

If you don't like historians talk to pro boxing trainers. Go and tell Teddy Atlas, Kevin Rooney or any other trainer that lived in that time period that prime Frazier would beat prime Foreman. After they laugh at you they will then tell you exactly what I have told you. They both feel exactly as I do and I've never met a trainer that knows both fighters that said different. Boxing 101 really. Sorry to break your bubble.

 

There is every indication that a FOTC Joe would have done better than the '76, out of shape, worn out Joe utilizing the '76 tactics. Of course
George could always have landed those bombs at any point and Joe would probably have gone back to his old style which would have been a mistake.

 

You just don't know boxing....a main reason boxing is dead today are guys like you. Train and condition but dont know boxing 101.

Common knowledge....You don't come foreword in a crouch fighting prime Foreman....he will put you into the bleacher seats. Too quick, too powerful, too strong..he only needs one punch. Frazier did not have the boxing skill to do well against Foreman as he was always there to be hit. He could not effectively change up his game. He had no right hand and poor coordination using his right in combination with his left. So with Joe..especially prime Joe nearly everything came from his left side. Joe actually developed some level of right late in his career. You can see this in his second bout with both Ellis and Quarry. It still however was not a coordinated punch that could be used in combination with his left. A right hand was the punch to hit prime Foreman with as Ali and Young showed. Foreman was effective defending against the hook as he generally kept his right hand up. It was his left that he kept low and dropped after his jab.

I loved Frazier and rooted for him in every fight he ever fought that I watched. That would be from 1971 till the end of his career. Id love to be able to say prime Joe would beat George but I can't. He would have no chance since he does not have the style, skills, power or physical strength to do anything with Foreman. Its just the truth and considered common thought by anyone that is knowledgable that lived during that time period.

You never even watched either fight? Im Speechless.

 

Too many trainers today know conditioning. Few know how to fight.

My opinion generally follows expert opinion because IM AN EXPERT!

Your opinion does not so........well you figure it out.

Finally Frazier could only fight one way so you would be training him to fight the way he always fights. A losing battle plan vs prime Foreman unfortunately but the only effective way he could fight.

 

Just for fun, I revisited Frazier/Forman 2. Funny you mention the uppercut defense because Frazier slips or blocks almost everyone Foreman throws in this fight. Foreman missing very wide at points and a quicker Frazier could no doubt take advantage like he did against Ali.


At any rate,

Round 1-Foreman Round. Frazier makes him miss the majority of his punches but doesn't return any fire. Foreman gets in one good left hook at the bell.

Round 2-Frazier Round. Ha, Frazier looks really good here, he slips the majority of Foreman's punches and lands some solid counters with his left.

Round 3-Foreman Round. Frazier comes out slow, gets caught standing upright by a Foreman straight right that knocks him back into the ropes. Frazier works his way out of trouble, but looking badly gassed. Foreman lands some body shots at the end of the round that doesn't help matters.

Round 4-Frazier Round. Foreman starts with a good right but Frazier gets his second wind and comes back with some left hands. Foreman misses lots of jabs and gets tagged with the left, swelling his eye up.

Round 5: KO...Frazier looks spent and gets easily cornered and blown over.


Interesting fight, I can see why I give Frazier the benefit of the doubt. He had Foreman missing in bunches but couldn't get his own punches off quick enough to counter and was overwhelmed as he slowed down. If Frazier could maintain the activity he had the first two rounds as we know he could in his prime, he very well could have been on to something.

 

Two of the three judges scored it a shutout. The other gave Joe one round. I had the fight 3-1 giving Joe the Fourth. Joe lost the second round. He landed 5-6 punches in total and spent too much time on the ropes taking shots especially the jab. Foreman was killing Joes body in round three. Once Foreman opened up like prime Foreman in the 5th the fight was quickly over.

 

Yes, Foreman was clearly the bigger hitter...and Oscar came within a whisker of beating Joe anyway. Joe was too easy to hit and his style is made for Big George- and easy win, as it alwasy would have been. It reminds me of the fight in Cool Hand Luke between Paul Newman and George Kennedy's characters- only even more one-sided.

Well, you obviously have, because if Fighter A beats Fighter B then he must beat Fighter C, that's how it's always worked :huh. No one is disputing that a fighter like Frazier would always be hell for an Ali...maybe even a Holmes..but not a Foreman...or even a Tyson, too easy to hit, too slow a starter. Also, George WAS favourite vs Ali, which means everything in your book seemingly, he must have had a bad off night. :hey

Joe hardly went in there with the bigger hitters of the 1970s, except Foreman, who mashed him completely. Look, you obviously really like Joe and desperately want to believe Jamaica was a fluke, so cling on to your comfort blanket with the other 0.2% who desperately want to convince themselves otherwise. Look, we all like the smaller guy winning, really, but most of us accept that strength and brute force very often come into play in the sport, especially in a brawl and the bigger, clumsier guy is sometimes too powerful. Never mind.

 

-I'm aware of the official scorecard but I would rather trust my own eyes. Boxing judges have proven to not be the most reliable bunch.

-So we ultimately just disagree about one round? :rofl

-I also think Frazier landed 5-6 good punches but I didn't see Foreman landing much of anything round 2.

-Oh, he dug some good punches to the body at the end of the round. That much is true. Foreman's strongest round before the knockout.

-Well, that's an odd impression. It looked to me more like Frazier's movement in the previous 4 rounds prevented Foreman from opening up like that, he certainly had him swinging at air when he tried.

 

Not a question about disagreeing on one round. Saying the bout was even at the end of four rounds portrays a false notion that it was a competitive bout. The fight was closer to a shutout than 3-1 or certainly 2-2.

 

-I'm not interested in false notions or implications, boxing is scored on a round by round system. I have it 2-2 at the time of the stoppage, you have it 3-1, we agree on the exact same 3 rounds and disagree on Round 2. So it is a question of us seeing just seeing one single round differently. That's not bad at all, in terms of scoring the fight, we see eye to eye.

-What is a competitive fight and how does that translate into round by round scoring? Ali won nearly every round against George Chuvalo, but it was hard earned competitive rounds. Scorecards never tell the whole story.

-Foreman was the aggressor in every round and he was never in visible trouble, but in Rounds 2 and 4 I saw Frazier score with more clean punches while he largely swung at air. So I scored the rounds to Frazier. Simple as that.

 

Why does there always have to be one ignorant not about anything idiot like you in this forum,,,,