Fred Apostoli vs Roy Jones @ 160

Apostoli is a level below Toney and Hopkins, whatever ridiculous excuses you have for their losses, neither would have got ko'd by a WW like Apostoli did

 

Neither is a level above Apostoli. I agree, however, that both are better than him when at their best. They weren´t at their best against Jones though.

 

Personally I'd disagree with all that, firstly Hopkins and Toney look better on film and achieved more than Apostoli for my liking

Secondly Hopkins not being prime, well he was 28 with more pro fights than Jones, his stamina, workrate and speed were at their peak and he was still skilled. He wouldnt be defeated for another 12years. Why was Hopkins so reluctant to rematch Jones if he was so far from prime when they fought?

Then to Toney - he was weight drained, well when wasn't he weight drained? He was always lazy making weight. Why would he be fine against Barkley a few months earlier and then drained against Jones, it doesn't make sense. Unless you think he was so pysched out by facing Jones he accepted a loss in advance and didn't even train as a result. You have to remember Jones was knocking out fighters in 1-2rounds that were going the distance with Toney

Anyway I thought you weren't debating Jones with me, did I suck you in

 

I don´t discuss Jones. I discuss Apostoli. And in my last post I stated what I think of him, not of Hopkins, Toney or Jones. That´s why I won´t say anymore than that your post just shows how much of a Jones fanboy you are.

 

You can say Toney was weight drained all you want, but Toney said himself that was the last fight he trained hard for. After he got dominated by Jones he stopped training so hard.

That Toney beats the **** out of Fred.

 

hopkins did get better but he was still a very good fighter the first time he fought jones. toney had trouble making weight but jones shouldn't be penalized because toney is a fat ass. jones dominated vs toney and prime vs prime jones is better than toney and bhop.

 

Why? He was a fellow HOFer and titleholder with big wins over other HOFers.

 

So you've seen that hotly disputed decision? What margin did you have Overlin winning by?

 

Well i know your proquest boy Dawson in the ny times had fred winning but the majority of nyc paps favored Ken, Ring Mag did as well.
ZOOORIGHT???

 

PS Thats really become the stupid bromide cliche question on this forum.
"So you saw the fight"??

 

Along with the Associated Press, the Pittsburgh Press, 10 of 12 ringside sportswriters polled, and a contingent of the fans.

So you have no clue, then.

Only among posters who provide analyses of fights they haven't seen.

 

Pittburgh Press did not have a body at this fight.
They ran a wire service account of this fight.

 

Your post right before this one stated that Hopkins and Toney weren't at their best for their fights with Jones.

 

What did Hype Igoe say?

 

Hopkins was a good contender but nothing special when Jones fought him. Not in the class of an atg. Jones´ shouldn´t be penalised that´s right but when judging him as a fighter that has to be remembered. Jones would always have beaten Toney, Toney´s weaknesses are movers who stay away from him, and potshot him. That´s what Jones does best. Nevertheless, the fight would have been closer with Toney at his best.

I don´t know if prime for prime Jones is better than Toney or Hopkins. I think he beats both because his strength - moving and staying out of range vs. Toney and speed vs. Hopkins - are the weaknesses of Toney and Hopkins.