Froch vs pavlik

Come on less of the sniping as you did start this.. Not biased, your honest opinion how badly does Froch get beaten?

 

Styles make fights, and that is Froch's REAL SERIOUS problem in this one, but first let's dispense with this notion that Carl is somehow way bigger than Kelly. Froch was 172 on fight night against JT. Pavlik weighed in at 160, and was 170 on fight night for Miranda. Pavlik is taller than Froch and walks around at a higher weight than Froch. There isn't a nickels worth of size difference over all.

Froch does not keep his hands up, nor does he have good head movement, and he is by no means quick. That means Pavlik finds a home for the jab almost immediately. Once the jab starts connecting, the right hand is right behind it, and that means a Pavlik opponent gets beat up.

Froch does not have good lateral movement. Against Pavlik you have to be able to move one direction, and quicky switch to the other direction. You also have to be able to move in and out at unexpected angles. You have to do all these things at once, AND counter effectively at the same time, ala Hopkins. Froch lacks the speed and coordination it takes to pull that off.

Froch is a slow starter. Pavlik likes to jump right out of the gate. Someone whose defense is as flawed as Carl's would allow Kelly to throw 80-90 punches a round, and connect 40% or more in the opening rounds 1-3. By round 4 Kelly would have that double-jab/right-hand mojo working well. No one against whom Pavlik made that work finished on his feet.

This is a very simple fight for KP -- jab-jab/right-hand, and a few left hooks thrown in. Froch gets put away in 7-8 rounds.

 

It could also mean that Pavlik could get tricked into trying to slug things out like he did against Miranada...and Froch's power (while a little overrated) is still strong enough to shake Kelly up if he gets lazy.

Remember Pavlik isn't exactly a defensive maestro...and Froch will NOT stop coming forward. It's a lot more complicated than you're making this ut to be.

 

Boo, why do you continually dismiss the size difference ? Pavliks walk around weight is irrelevant,he's a 160 fighter.He may have fought beyond that but the fact remains he's a 160 fighter.Froch is a 168 fighter and the difference will be felt by Pavlik if this fight happens.Froch may be basic,he may be a slow starter,he may have no defence,and the likelihood is Pavlik would find the target BUT Froch will soon start landing with his own shots and i dont think Pavlik will have an answer.Had Taylor been more patient he would have finished Kelly,and although Taylor caught and dropped Froch,he was never in serious trouble.Watch the vids,Froch was clear headed and took the count,kelly was doing the "silly dance" and very nearly stopped.The facts are there for all to see,and yet we are hearing all the same comments and predictions that we heard before the Froch v Taylor fight !! At 168 Pavlik will not have the tools,the power,or the substance to beat any of the current 168 belt holders.

 

They are talking to Sturm and Abraham. If Kelly was ready to leave 160 he might fight Froch if he still had the belt. Then he could switch divisions and still be 'champ'.

 

How many of Kelly's 14 fights above 160 have you actually seen? I'm guessing that you saw somewhere between zero and two.

Froch is NOT bigger than Pavlik, and no matter how many times you say he is, Carl is not going to suddenly gain 10 pounds and grow 2 inches.

If Jermain ****ing Taylor backed Froch up, which he did, you can bet your house that Pavlik would put him on the back foot and keep him there.

Carl is simply to slow, to easy to hit, and not fundamentally sound enough to avoid Pavlikation in under 8 rounds. It would not surprise me to see it happen in under 3 rounds. Think about the several seconds before JT knocked Froch down. Carl got pushed back to the ropes by Taylor's power. Right there is where Pavlik's superior fire power would end Froch, or at the very least, put Froch in a no win situation by hurting him really bad.

 

Froch has his own style which is obviously working for him, i definatley think that people underestimate his boxing ability, to be fair to Froch he went to America and fought in Taylors back yard and won. What I will say is that I have never seen Froch as nervous as that in a fight before and quite rightly so.
To me the fight with Taylor was a massive step for him and he pulled it off this win will make him a more confident fighter and hopefully settle him, as when he chooses to fight in America again.
People say that Jt is not a big puncher but he knocked down Froch as he did to Pavlik too and nearly ended the fight in the 2nd round, to be fair to Pavlik he got his tactics right in the second fight and won by unanimous decision.
I think if Froch and Pavlik make this fight happen then i think you will see a different Froch in the ring and it will make a interesting battle of styles but I see Froch winning with a Cobra uppercut in the 10th round, lights out. I apologise for my mistake on here you were right about his fights at SM. :good

 

Do i need to spell it out ? Froch fights at 168,Pavlik fights at 160,forget what either may have done at different weights in the past and concentrate on the weight for which they are recognised.Hatton walks around between fights at 168-175 lbs,does this mean he'll be more effective at welter ? light middle ? middle ? at anything above 140 Hatton has been found wanting.At top level Kelly has fought twice above his recognised 160 limit,a rematch with a gun shy and zero confidence Taylor (who was also fighting above his recognised weight),but credit where its due,Pavlik boxed well and won a close fight,and another against Hopkins where he was beaten in every dept and although physically as big as BHop,Pavlik was clearly the "smaller fighter" and every punch BHop landed had a visible effect.Where were Pavliks fundamentals,speed,power,defence that night ? did he leave them in the locker room ? Please dont throw the elbow injury and serious Bronchial condition into the poor performance,had Pavlik been in such bad shape the doctor at the pre fight medical would have never allowed the fight to start,Pavlik couldn't perform with the extra weight on him,and was feeling the difference in power every time BHop landed.If Froch could somehow dry down to 160 or maybe even 164 i'd put my money on Pavlik,but at 168 or above Froch stops Pavlik by brutal KO after a shakey start.Froch looked like a rabbit caught in a cars headlights at the 1st bell against Taylor,i dont think we'll ever see him looking so nervous again.

 

i respect your opinion but...

i think everyone agrees that both pav and froch have heart, a good chin and can throw a punch (pav i would argue has more pop)...that being said what is it about what froch does that makes you think this will happen??

what is it about froch's low (very low) guard and chin hanging above his lead foot that makes you think he isnt going to eat flush rights all night long?

what is it about froch's offense that you see will give pav problems?? considering froch and bhop are not on the same planet when it comes to lateral movement, slickness and ability to nullify an opponent's strengths??

not saying you don't have an answer to these questions...i would just like to hear it

p.s. did anyone see that link on the pav/williams thread about pav in rehab...boo?? anyone?? wtf is up w/ that???

 

I haven't heard from my sources, but if it is true, I don't think I will. I would expect a 'release'. They wouldn't tell me something like this until there was an 'official' statement of some sort. They aren't exactly people that live on line either, so a denial could take a while. I just happen to be off work today because of a sore back.

 

You don't know much and you make **** up. Kelly hurt his hand early in the second Taylor fight. Kelly's condition for the Bhop fight is documented. Just watch the fight in between rounds where he has a foot of snot hanging they have to wipe off.

 

there is a big thread in the lounge about it...a few posts worth reading in a mix of posters ripping on each other.

this would ruin my month if its true. there's also a post in the lounge thread that he got into a scuffle with police before taylor and that the hand through the window was alcohol related??

**** me...

 

The scuffle with police is known. That version of the window story, never heard that, but is possible I guess. Lying seems to be acceptable in boxing so you just never know. Very sad.

 

your right...just never know. i hope some more info is forthcoming...