Fury finally talks...and he's delusional as ever...

I admire your perseverance, mate. But it’s futile I’m afraid.

 

There you go. That’s literally what the rules say about who is winning the round. Landing more clean punches is the most important factor. Usyk won the round.

 

Fury TKO 6 in the rematch

 

There's an important distinction here that you're missing. The scoring crtieria is not about who landed more clean and effective punches. It's who did better in terms of "clean effective punching". That means if you land less clean effective punches than the opponent but the clean effective punches that you do land were better than the sum of the clean effective punches that the opponent land, then you win the category. That's what happened here and that's what happened in Canelo Bivol rounds 1-4. Bivol outlanded Canelo in every round, but Canelo landed the harder more effective punches in rounds 1-4. That's why he won those rounds. Most fans on here don't seem to understand this concept and when I try to explain it, it's like I'm speaking a different language.

And again, I'm not saying you have to score the first 4 rounds of Bivol to Canelo, I'm not saying that you have to score Round 2 in Fury Usyk to Fury. I myself was conflicted on scoring that to Fury. But that is in fact how the rounds were scored by the judges. So 2 of the judges noticed Fury's hard eye catching shots towards the end of the round and valued them more than all the Usyk body shots. While the other judge wasn't swayed by Fury's strong last minute, he thought, like you, that Usyk did enough over the first 2 minutes to offset Fury's late rally.

It's subjective, ya know, but I'm just pointing out a distinction that it's not who landed more clean effective punches, it's "clean effective punching" generally, meaning who landed the cleaner more effective punches, even if there were less of them than the opponent, but if they were better, as Fury's were, less better/harder punches can offset more not as good punches.

Like Canelo Bivol Rounds 1-4. Bivol outlanded Canelo in each of those rounds, but they were light punches that had minimal impact. And many of them were partially blocked or slipped. While Canelo loaded up on shots and landed the no doubt about it earth shattering punches, including those bicep bombs. That's why he won those rounds. I never even went out of my way to argue he for sure won those rounds, because I knew how close and hard to score rounds like that were. I simply said I had no issue with the judges giving those rounds to Canelo because (unlike many who came at me in regards to that, and some who still do) I understand the scoring criteria and recognize the difference in the shots Canelo landed vs Bivol and how the judges interpret those, and I knew what can be considered a scoring shot.

Dopes like lordy have no concept of the nuance here. Unlike lordy and some others though, you seem to be more open minded so more of this will make sense. But keep in mind, that although I scored Round 2 for Fury, your points are valid and you have a strong argument for Usyk winning the round. All I'm saying is that the Furious One did close the gap in that final minute and landed some great shots that left an impression in the minds of the judges, which is why two judges gave him that round.

And the reverse is true as well. Round 7, how did you score that one? That's like the opposite of Round 2. Round 7 Fury was out landing Usyk in terms of clean punches over the first 2 minutes. But then what happened in the final minute. Usyk landed an incredible series of punches that made the round difficult to score. Now all 3 judges gave that round for Fury despite the late rally but Usyk, but arguably Fury was even more dominant over the first 2½ minutes of round 7 than Usyk was over the first 2½ minutes of Round 2.

But the thing is, the fans are split on Rounds like 2 and 7. You had some people scoring 2 for Usyk and 7 for Fury, you had me scoring 2 for Fury and 7 for Usyk. But to give both those rounds to Usyk or Fury, I mean that sort of creates an inaccurate score when you consider what happened down the stretch. So this all very debatable, but I think you understand where I'm coming from. I'm trying to score this as accurately as possible. And I get where your'e coming too, you make some great points and have a strong case for Usyk winning the rounds.

So we don't need to fight over this, we can agree to disagree, but you should be able to at least admit that Fury closed the gap significantly in that final minute of Round 2. Maybe it wasn't enough for you to offset Usyk's steady body work over the first 2 miuntes, which I respect but it's certainly debatable who won that round and Fury definitely has at the very least an argument given how well he came back in the final minute.

The problem is you don't consider a lot of Fury's jabs as clean punche when in fact they were, and those jabs that we disagree on are landed punches that can offset many of Usyk's jabs to the body. The other problem is that jabs to the head, even light jabs, that land clean (as many of Fury's did) are often more noticeable to judges than body shots. I'm big on body shots though which is why as I stated I was so conflicted over Round 2. But it wasn't two hard punches, it was more than two hard punches. But even two hard punches can be enough to offset multiple softer punches even if they landed clean. We talk about effectiveness, lets face it, Fury wasn't too bothered by most of Usyk's body shots. Fury's two hard shots in that ifnal minute were far more impactful and damaging than any of Usyk's body shots earlier in the round.

And even some of Fury's jabs were harder than most of Usyk's body shots. So Fury landed the harder shots, and out jabbed Usyk, he outworked Usyk, he made Usyk miss wildly several times, and he finished the round strong. I mean there's a lot of good reasons to score the round for Fury. But it's very debatable and I your position is not unreasonable. But I think now you have a better sense of why Fury won Round 2 on 2 judges cards than you did before, and why many fans gave that round to Fury. You can disagree, but it's very debatable.

Throwing more is just one of many factoes that in the past, some fans have argued is a reason why someone should win a close round. How many times in the past have posters on here said, well in a close round that's hard to score, I give it ot the guy throwing punches. People have said that before, now I'm not generally someone who says that but that's been an argument in the past, for example to why many people believe GGG beat Canelo in the first 2 fights. They admit Canelo landed the better shots but that GGG out volumed Canelo in more rounds, etc. Those were popular arguments as to why much of this board scored those matches for GGG. And I scored them to Canelo not because he outworked GGG or outlanded GGG but because he landed the harder more impactful more eye catching shots, because he showed more skill in more reounds, better defense, making him miss, etc.

On that point, how did you score Round 7? Because in Round 7, Fury won 2:30 of a round, before Fury got caught with two big punches at the end. Was that enough for Usyk to steal that round? I said yes because those punches in the final 30 seconds from usyk were so much better than anything Fury landed in the first 2:30 even though he was pretty much dominating up to that point. But some big eye catchings hots in last 30 seconds can turn a round on its head if they are good enough punches.

 

Not who landed more clean punches in a round, but rather who did better in terms of "clean effective punches" in totality. Meaning, you can land less clean punches than your opponent but if those fewer clean punches were harder and more effective than anything the opponent landed, that can offset more lighter clean punches landed by the opponent. Further, jabs are part of that equation. Fury clearly landed far more jabs to the head in the round, and he landed several jabs to the head that were harder than anything Usyk landed to the body. He also landed the harder power punches, albeit less of them than Usyk. So yes, Usyk did land more clean punches overall, particularly to the body while Fury landed the harder and more eye catching shots, and more jabs to the head, and Fury left a lasting impression in the minds of the judges by how well he finished the round, making it a very hard to score round.

 

Oh this guy still going? Shadow you my ignored friend had no life?
You still going with your delusion about the Shoulder Punches?
This thread is very telling for the mental gymnastics Shadow was pulling back in the day where Canelo got schooled by his daddy Bivol:
[url]https://www.boxingforum24.com/threads/do-punches-landed-on-the-arms-count.686489/[/url]

I mean i never seen more delusional guy than shadow, and not just delusional, but biased as hell.
Firstly the rule where "shoulder" punches maybe considered to be scoring blow is only in 1 article, without signature, and not have any officiating on it.
It's also clearly stated that it's maybe considered, and that Arms are considered defensive mechanism, aka punches blocked with them is not a scoring ones. And its specifically mentioned that in situation that you may consider shoulder punches as scoring where a fighter does nothing but cover up, and there should still be a judgement factor whether this is scoring blows or not. Again this is from some article from 2022, and is deleted from the ABC sites, and their RULES the only punches that is considered scoring is body and head.
Any other Governing Bodies also have only body and head, and body does not include the arms/shoulder, etc.

Usyk - Fury was hosted by BBBOC, as Saudi works with them, and this is their rules:

Curious though, why this dishonest person shadow not even once mentioned that holding to the ropes is illegal, and should have cost Fury points?
How punches with open gloves is illegal, and ARE NOT CONSIDERED scoring punches.
And a lot of Fury punches was with open glove, which are first illegal and second not a scoring shot.

 

Continue, straight from the BBBOC Rules:
Points will be awarded:– For “attack” – direct clean hits with the knuckle part of the glove of either hand to any part of the front or side of the head or body above the belt.

For “defence” – guarding, slipping, ducking, or getting away from an attack. Where contestants are otherwise equal the majority of points will be given to the one who does most leading off or displays the better style.

The following acts shall not be permitted during a contest:–
hitting below the belt;
hitting on the back of the head or neck;
kidney punching;
hitting with the open glove, the inside, or the butt or the back of the hand, or with the wrist or elbow;
holding, butting, or careless use of the head, shouldering, wrestling or roughing;

• The Referee shall award a maximum of ten points at the end of each round to the better Boxer and a lesser number to the other Boxer, the difference between the scores reflecting the level of superiority of the better Boxer. Only full points (and not fractions of a point) shall be awarded. If the Referee considers the round was even they will then award ten points to each Boxer.

• The guiding principle in deciding which Boxer has had the better of each round is the quantity and quality of scoring punches, i.e. correctly delivered blows (with the knuckle part of the closed glove of either hand) which land on the target area (any part of the front or sides of the head or body above the belt).

• Other factors to be considered are effective aggression (leading off, providing such leading is effective), defence (guarding, slipping, ducking, getting away, etc.) and technical style.

• While boxing is regarded as the “art of self-defence”, it is (generally speaking) an attacking sport and the Boxer who is prepared to carry the Contest to their opponent should be credited for this when the Referee assesses a round, unless their efforts to carry the Contest have been ineffective.

• However, according to the Regulations, reward must be given for defence, which includes guarding, slipping, ducking and getting away. It is possible for a Boxer to box on the back foot for the whole of a Contest and win on points if they have landed the greater number of scoring punches. As an example, Boxer A attacks and leads off, but Boxer B slips the lead and counters with a scoring blow: Boxer B therefore emerges from that exchange better than Boxer A, according to the Regulations.

And again educate yourself troll:

• Ring Generalship: The fighter who controls the action and enforces their will and style.

Based on shadow opinion, we should fired every single martial art coach, as everyone will tell you chin down, shoulder up to protect your chin. And essentially when you throwing punches with decent technique with your shoulders being up, you are essentially protected for counters from that side, as shoulder is your protection. Also shoulder roll is a well known defensive move, that if shoulder was scoring punches, no one would have use. And Floyd should have like 10 loses on his record lol.

Guy like shadow don't get that, as he never step in any Martial Art Gym in his life.

I hope this help for the people that get confused with shadow mental gymnastics.

 

I agree fully regarding his shenanigans outside the ring, but it doesn't cloud my judgement

He lost close rounds to usyk other than 9 and dominated a couple himself

Aj won rounds that usyk tool off for a breather. Completely different fights. You need to be major biased to say Joshua performed better. He definitely didn't

 

Fury's career is built off his ability to lie and convince weak-minded fools into believing he is great, rather than his actual skills.

 

Jabbr has Usyk winning 9-2 with round 3 being too close to call. The result of the fight is inarguable. I said giving Fury 4 rounds was generous, but it should have been 3 rounds.

 

I don't feel sorry for these PoS fans unless they truly believe what Fury is saying, which I find very hard to believe.

 

I have a sneaking suspicion that Fury and Usyk have talked as men behind the scenes, and respect each other immensely. This is all a part of the show.

Or Fury is just a lunatic, but I doubt it.

 

To quote the great boxing historian Monte D Cox " A "clean" blow is one that lands flush without being blocked by his opponent. But how many times has one heard an announcer "Oh what a left hook by so and so!" The problem is the punch landed on his opponent's glove and only made a loud noise and didn't score at all. Some blows are "partially blocked"; meaning it did not land with its full force. Such blows are not "clean" punches. Also it is not the amount of punches that are thrown the matters, but the amount of blows that land. Hard punching is important as the amount of damage a blow causes counts in the scoring. In the amateurs a knockdown is only as good as a jab, but in the pro's its worth much more. One hard right that staggers the opponent though is not worth ten hard jabs that snap back the opponent's head. Damaging blows and their value are difficult to assess and that is why boxing is subjective. However it should be noted that landing 3 or 4 punches that hurt an opponent in the last seconds of a round are not enough to make up for losing the first two and a half minutes of the round where he was out-boxed." Based on that Usky landed the more cleaner blows and won most of the round therefor two good punches at the end are not enough to offset this

I think I scored it for usyk but it was a close round that could have gone either way I can try to rewatch it from what i remember it was pretty back and forth until Usyk won it at the end Fury wasn't winning it like how Usyk won most of the 2nd so while I an see the 7th for Fury I don't think you can make a resonable argument that he won the 2nd

7th sure 2nd most people had for Usyk from what i saw

I don't see it but if you value two hard blows over everything else that happened in the round sure i guess we can agree to disagree

Because most of his jabs weren't clean punches they were either blocked, glancing blows, or just light touches there were only like 2 clean jabs that Fury landed which I don't think was enough to offset all the clean shots Usyk was landing

If that's the narrative you want to take to convince yourself sure but that's not at all what I saw from rewatching the round it was a clear round for Usyk

Sure I scored the second fight for Canelo for the same reason but I just didn't see that in this fight Usyk landed more and landed the better shots for the most part besides several infrequent shots Fury landed

I'd have to rewatch it but I can give you an answer when I do

 

Rewatching the 7th Fury won the first minute second minute was close Usyk landed a good straight and a body shot Fury landed a jab and an uppercut near the end. 3rd minute was pretty even until Usyk landed a really combination to close the round. Overall really close round I could see it going either way much closer then 2nd which was a clear Usyk round in my view. But I'd probably lean Usyk just because it was an even round that he closed well but I could see it for Fury as well

 

People are such fan boys for both of these guys… it really muddles the narrative of and around their fight…

It was a good and arguably close fight, and the right guy won. Fury is wrong to think he deserved the decision, but I won’t criticize him too much for that, I’ve seen fighters be WAY less competitive and think they won…

As far as the things Fury has said goes, he was pretty tame in that interview… Im surprised about all the fuss it’s causing.