Gene Tunney vs Max SCHMELING

Peak max Schmeling was flat out better than the inactive 32 year old past his prime Jack Dempsey

I would say Joe Louis of 36 is a far better fighter than any version of Dempsey and Tunney. Max dominated him

 

I agree

 

agreed on the first part. my point was about how tunney would fight vs max, not a comparison of their ability.

not sure about the 2nd in relation to this fight, louis deserves the acknowledgment that his brain may have been 2 scrambled to make the adjustment, but it's still true that he kept making the same move that allowed max to land his right. i think it's reasonable to say tunney would be more adaptable in the fight. plus he was a whole different style to louis anyway.
while max's footwork was efficient and effective, he wasn't the quickest of foot and i don't see him being able to cut the ring off on tunney too easily (depends on the ring size of course)

 

1. Tunney more adaptable than 36 louis? Ok

2. Tunney better than 36 Louis? No. Louis himself admitted Max Baer fight was his peak, that took place in 35. So Louis was in his prime in 36. Louis in his prime is arguably the greatest heavyweight of all time, better than Tunney for sure

3. Louis a different style to Tunney yes, but Schmeling is a lot different style to Dempsey. Schmeling wouldn't be coming off a 3 year layoff to fight Tunney. Schmeling was smart, in shape, and had impeccable timing in his punches

4. Footwork wouldn't matter unless you think Tunney is going to outbox Schmeling at a distance? I don't see that happening. Schmeling had same height and reach as Tunney, and fought with his right hand high, with a slight lean Charley burley esq...it's tough to box circles around this style, because Schmeling makes himself a difficult target to hit. The only way for Tunney to hit Schmeling is to walk into the range of Schmelings right hand, which he would time right over genes low left. Tunney was susceptible to a straight counter right with his straight up low hands style.

Tunney would land his jab, but Schmeling would land the harder cleaner blows and takes it on points

 

wow, I see another SuzieQ vs mcvey classic in the making!!

 

shmelling would crush him...Tunney looked like Charlie chaplin if we compared them!

 

Gene Tunney

 

1. maybe, louis lost to max largely because he didn't or couldn't adapt(still with the disclaimer from b4).

2. I never wrote that tunney was better than louis, but that doesn't mean he can't be better than loius in certain aspects.
is it so simple that 36 louis was the best louis, and schmelling beat him comfortably, so max is ze goat? (i also don't think for a that a fighter who gets kd'd multiple times by the same punch, because he keeps making the same mistake is better than the version from a few years later who had somewhat corrected that flaw, but it's hard to argue with the man himself)

3. i meant schmelling and dempsey different styles, i should have been clearer. i also said schmelling would time him sometimes in my first post.

4. that's weak, footwork matters in pretty much any type of fight.


It's just a fantasy fight, and one where either guy could clearly win, i think tunney has the better of the 50/50, maybe just under 60/40, I could be persuaded it's the other way, but not with this.

 

I don't think Tunney fought much like Louis.

Max clearly stopped Louis . Dominated is a bit over the top imo ,it was voted the fight of the year so I guess it was competitive.
Schmeling finished with both eyes swollen from Louis' jab, one was nearly shut.Max was also cut under the right eye the result of a left hook in the 4th round.

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Louis said he could find Schmeling easy with his jab ,I think Tunney would be able to as well,and Tunney had much better wheels than Louis.
When Schmeling tagged Louis in the fourth knocking him down for a 2 count Louis said he never really recovered from it. It was Louis' first kd as a pro he was not used to being under pressure.Tunney would have got on his bike , not stood there trying to fight his way out of the fog.

 

Louis went into the first Schmeling fight overconfident and for the first time did not follow his training regime. He had recently discovered golf and took his clubs to camp with him.

"When I entered training camp ,I had the idea that I was going to do a lot of hard work for nothing.I thought I could name the round that I would knock Schmeling out .

Instead of training as I should have,I'd cut my training short and jump in my car and head for the golf course."

"Instead of boxing 6 rounds I'd box three. Punch the bag one instead of two.I'd even sneak off to Atlantic City when I got the chance to see some girl whose name I don't even remember" '

"Instead of gradually working p toa physical peak I began bearing down and melting off weight.Could take it off easy enough but couldn't put it back on.That weakened me."

Louis had been married to a beautiful woman for 9 months she was in camp, on top of which he was screwing everything that moved on the side.
Louis scaled 2126lbs when he went to camp and two weeks before the fight 204lbs in the five weeks before the fight Louis lost18lbs.

Blackburn banned him from the golf course because he was dehydrating himself in the hot sun.
Louis basically told him to f*ck himself.
Five days before the fight Louis beat up Salvatore Ruggerilllo so bad he quit in the 1 st rd, Louis thought he was superman.


.Blackburn kept drumming into Louis he will be waiting for you to lead with the jab hoping you'll drop your left arm so he can cross his right, Louis told him sh*t if that's all I got to worry about its nothing.

LouIs said later that Schmeling held his left arm so high in that fight that he was open to a body attack from his right hand, but instead he went head hunting.
Louis was badly hurt in the 2nd rd and barely stayed on his feet after a right hand found the mark.Schmeling was content to draw the lead and counter over it but only when he was sure of connecting.

Louis hurt Schmeling to the body in the 3rd with right uppercuts. It wasn't a one sided fight . What Schmeling did to an overconfident Louis is no indication to how successful he would be against an ice cool Tunney.imo

 

I've always wondered about this :
In 1936 Schmeling aged 31 ko'd Joe Louis who was 22 years old.
In 1938 Schmeling AGEG 33 was ko'd by Louis who was 24 years of age.
SO-
What would have happened in a fight in 1936 and 1938 if Joe Louis was
a creaky old 33 and Schmeling was at 24 years of age ".???
Thoughts ?

 

Max would be the toughest Heavyweight that Gene faced, other than a rusty Dempsey, Tunney's heavyweight record is thin. Gene has an excellent record as a light heavyweight and this resume is what would make us believe a Schmeling fight would be very interesting. Schmeling also beat some very good fighters, Louis,Walker and Sharkey. tough pick 4 me

 

No sane poster would pick an easy win here for either man,imo.

 

I'd pick Schmeling simply because he's more proven at this level.

 

He has certainly more heavyweight scalps but not many of great note imo.Louis is his flagship.