Gene Tunney, Why isn’t he higher on the all time list?

I rate Tunney as the 2nd or 3rd best LHW all-time & among the top 30 fighters all time - he outfought arguably the #1 or 2 best fighter ever multiple times & dethroned an ATG HW champ, + beat other HoFers like Gibbons, Carpentier, & Levinsky while only suffering one official loss himself.

 

Ironically, it was Wills who ultimately declined an offer to fight Tunney while Tunney was campaigning for a shot at Dempsey.

 

Understandable on Willis's part. If Tunney wasn't the champ why would Willis want to risk his status as pseudo champ for nothing? Title eliminators are only appealing to fighters who have something to gain from them. Willis was treading water waiting for someone to put a belt on him as the years of Dempseys inactivity piled up.

 

Not top 10 HW for me......not enough big names at that weight. He genuinely beat Greb only when Greb was basically finished and had only 1 good eye. And Tunney always outweighed Greb.

I suppose all time he is top 10 LHW due to a better resume and a couple HOFers atvthat weight. But he was the Caanelo of his day; the NYC boxing gods always supported him and protected him and got him fights with guys at the right time and ONLY at the right time. In his lifetime he was considered an ATG but can anyone see he beating Bob Foster, Ezzard Charles, Michael Spinks? Besides the fact that he wouldn't get in the ring with them anyway.

 

Hi Buddy.
I also rate Tunney as a fighter and a LHW, respect your opinion on where you would put him on a top ten list., for me : Spinks, Moore, Charles, and Foster would have the beating of him, and I think Saad would give him a hard night.
stay safe bolo, have enjoyed your post of late, and your making a valid contribution to the forum, polite and informative.

 

Even Usyk rates higher than Tunney at Heavyweight in all honesty.

 

I’m not holding the color line against him although I certainly acknowledge that it was wrong, things were as they were back then and that history can’t be changed. I still have him in my top 20 or on the fringes but the simple fact is that in 100 years, better people have come along who have pushed him down the list. And I rank Dempsey 12th on my ATG heavy list.

 

Several white fighters didn't draw the color line tthough, right ? So it was more like a choice you could make without getting too much heat rather than something you had to do !

 

If you draw the color line and your claim to fame at HW is beating an old inactive Dempsey, future fans aren't going to be so forgiving.

He obviously had skill and some decent wins, but I just don't rate him that high for a pretty bland career. Had he fought some black light heavies and/or more quality heavies we'd be having a different conversation.

 

Tunney beat Greb, he dominated Dempsey, he looks great on film and he was clearly peaking when he decided to call it a day. He deserves to rate high in a p4p sense and at light heavy. Heavyweight was too brief and Dempsey was clearly well post prime. Great fighter overall but not a great heavyweight legacy.

 

Obviously, you didn't understand the post as losing giving up 12 pounds is a mark against you. As the Greb win ( wins ) are up there as the best wins in history

 

I understand that. I just try in these discussions to look at people solely as boxers, because to venture off elsewhere gets into things that because of today’s polarized environment I simply don’t discuss online or on social media. The color line in all sports was an abomination, that’s as far as I will go.

 

Historians Rankings Of the Top 10 All-Time Heavyweights


Nat Fleischer, Founder of Ring Magazine, 1958, 1971.


Jack Johnson

Jim Jeffries

Bob Fitzsimmons

Jack Dempsey

Jim Corbett

Joe Louis

Sam Langford

Gene Tunney*

Max Schemling

Rocky Marciano



Charley Rose, 1968


Sam Langford

Jack Johnson

Jack Dempsey

Joe Louis

Jim Jeffries

Gene Tunney*

Sam McVey

Rocky Marciano

Jim Corbett

Max Baer



World Boxing 1974 Readers Poll


Joe Louis


Jack Dempsey


Rocky Marciano


Jack Johnson


Muhammad Ali


Joe Frazier


Gene Tunney*


Jim Jeffries


Sonny Liston


Ezzard Charles



Nat Loubet, 1975


Joe Louis


Jack Dempsey


Jim Jeffries


Jack Johnson


Rocky Marciano


Gene Tunney*


Bob Fitzsimmons


James J. Corbett


Muhammad Ali


Joe Frazier



John Durant -Author of "The Heavyweight Champions" (1976)


Joe Louis


Jack Johnson


Jack Dempsey


Muhammad Ali


Gene Tunney*


Joe Frazier


Jim Jeffries


James J. Corbett


Rocky Marciano


Max Schemling



Bill Brennan 1978 (Former President of the WBA)


Muhammad Ali


Joe Louis


Jack Dempsey


Jack Johnson


Gene Tunney*


Jim Jeffries


Max Schemeling


Rocky Marciano


James J. Corebett


Bob Fitzsimmons



Big Book of Boxing Reader Poll, 1978


Joe Louis


Muhammad Ali


Rocky Marciano


Jack Dempsey


Jack Johnson


Gene Tunney*


Joe Frazier


Jim Jeffries


Ezzard Charles


Sonny Liston



Gilbert Odd, 1985 (Kings of the Ring)


Muhammad Ali


Joe Louis


Jack Johnson


Floyd Patterson


Jack Dempsey


Jim Jeffries


Tommy Burns


Gene Tunney*


Jim Corbett


Max Schmeling



Bert Sugar, 1991


Jack Dempsey


Joe Louis


Muhammad Ali


Jack Johnson


Gene Tunney*


Rocky Marciano


Joe Frazier


Larry Holmes


Sonny Liston


Mike Tyson



Arthur Harris, 1992 (Nov 1992 Boxing Scene)


Muhammad Ali


Joe Louis


Jack Dempsey


Jack Johnson


Gene Tunney*


Rocky Marciano


Larry Holmes


Jersey Joe Walcott


Joe Frazier

Sonny Liston

 

At the end of the day you might be right although my own personal preference is not to rate any active athletes in any sport as far as ATG status, because their hay isn’t completely in the barn and how they finish is just as important to me as what they did on the way there.

 

I heard he thought he was smarter than anyone else...and that makes me angry!