George Foreman , overrated ?

Joe Louis had a longer reign...against a bum of the month tour. Do you honestly think those guys would have a chance against Foreman? It was like a trained spartan warrior vs cavemen with sticks, he was light years ahead of 90% of his opponents in ring iq.

Joes best wins were schmeling, walcott, m baer, b baer, conn, before his first retirement.

Lost to schmeling, charles, and marciano.

By most accounts, Joe got his ass kicked by walcott in the first fight. Dropped twice, out outboxed, made to look foolish and booed. To his credit he made adjustment and stopped walcott in the rematch but it exposed major flaws in his gameplay and the establishment was on his side. Conn outboxed him for 12 rounds and dropped him, a feather fisted light heavy, and only lost because he was ahead of himself and tried to get cute looking for a ko. In the modern era, conn would have won by lopsided UD.

No excuse for getting nailed by 200 right hands from a past his prime schmeling. Seriously, people talk about alis weakness to hooks or foremans brawling but this was y far an incredibly dumb performanc. And he was in his prime and undefeated!

Charles, a skinny light heavy who simply outclassed him and beat his ass. Youd think hed learn his lesson but no, he continued his comeback attempts and was flattened by an awkward, chubby, stubby armed rocky marciano who never even weighed 200 lbs his whole career!

So in terms of legacy, did Joe really prove he was the absolute best of his era? 1-1 with max, basically 1-1 with walcott if were being honest, barrly scraped by conn and nearly lost the decison, lost to charles, lost to marciano. The baer brothers and braddock are ok wins but no one can name a single guy buddy baer koed and braddock had like what, 30+ losses? And dont get me startrd on golotas fat ass who nearly koed him.

-never proved he was the absolute best against his contemporaries
-went 3-4 against fellow atgs.
-had MANY disputed and controversial decisions
-feasted on bums who wouldnt make a top 20 ranking in most eras.
-died completely broke losing all his money.

Tyson

Beat a fat near 40 holmes coming off a 1 year layoff and loss, terrified light heavy spinks (who only beaf 2 hws), b level berbick, a completely unmotivated chubby tubbs who made zero effort and basically took a dive, biggs who was a great amateur but accomolished NOTHING as a pro, couldnt ko a tucker who broke his hand, and a one dimensional swing for the fences no defence 1 armed ruddock. Not the most glorious list of opponents eh? But lets continue.

He then came back and beat bruce seldon who literally took his mouth piece out after one grazing punch that barrly landed and refused to get up. He got his ass kicked by a past his prime shopworn holyfield. He never became undisputed again and was basically a side show people either paid to see him ko bums or get his ass kicked. He lost to a fat past his prime lennox who was OLDER than him. He never fought morrison, mercer, bowe, tua, witherspoon, and many other big names of the era somehow.

-He was 0-3 against the two other biggest name ATG's of his era (lennox and holyfield).
-had the shortest so called "prime" of any hw in history.
-lost all his money, literally over $50 million+ over the course of his career.
-never beat a prime atg or hofer.
-never came back when down on points to win
-never got off the floor to win and was koed 5x.

How the hell was his career better than foremans? He mght have been the most exciting heavyweight and the highest paid athlete for a few years, but what does it matter if you lose all that money and all people can remember is you losing to a 42-1 underdog and any decent A level fighter?

Vitali Klitschko

-best wins were c level arreola, a wheezing past his briggs who literally just stood there all night, a fat part time golfer corrie sanders, an obese flat footed arm punching samuel peter who had a ring iq in the negatives, and an "ok" journeyman in chisora.

-Was stopped by former light heavyweight in chris byrd. Got his face torn to shreds by a fat unmotivated old lennox lewis. He was 0-2 against ATGs.

-never became undisputed or proved he was the best of his era.

-nobody knows who tf he even is outside of hardcore fans and some Europans. Refused to fight his brother (despite the two of them bragging about who got the better of who in sparring) and thus we had to endure 10 years of one of the most boring hw eras ever. If one brother lost, the other would avenge it...wtf?

-vitali may have a good stoppage rate, but he was huge. Bigger than nearly every single opponent, threw akward robotic arm punches, and fought mostly has beens of the 90's and fat slobs with no defense. And despite all that most opponets remained on their feet, he wasnt a true ko artist the ref would wave it off.

If you are 0-2 against fellow atgs and nobody can name anyone you beat, your career wasnt better than Foremans, end of discussion.

Sonny Liston

-best wins were machen, folley, williams, patterson
-lost twice to ali, fought mostly c level guys in europe, then got his ass kicked by his own sparring partner. Had one last decent performance against wepner.

I dont see any of the guys he beat winning against foreman and they both lost to ali, soooo...how the hell was his career better? Drank away most of his money or it ended up in the pockets of his shady affiliates, never won gold as an amateur, never regained the title. Stupid to even attempt to list liston above foreman in tems of legacy.

 

Conn dropped Louis? What round was that in?

 

Old Hawk Eye Mcvey!

 

My mistake. When cross examining long extensive careers of 11 different boxers you can remember 1 detail incorrectly.

 

Louis was the best heavyweight in the world from 1935 to 1948. During this time his only loss was to Schmelling which he brutally avenged. Losses to Charles and Walcott occurred when he was past hia prime and after the period in question. As far as speculating on what Foreman would do to them I might point out that guys are judged on what they do in their own eras. Foremans lack of size would be a problem for him in todays division i imagine. Should he be penalized for not fighting skilled big men like Joshua?

 

Ever ready to drop the hammer on the unsuspecting!

 

Is his lack of size a problem for Deontay Wilder?

 

Its my job!lol

 

Is this thread as stupid as the title would make it seem?

I have an answer to the topic..

No.

End thread.

 

Who has Wilder beaten? I dont see him beating Joshua and frankly im not even convinced hes better jarrrell miller. In any case Foreman doesnt have his height and reach to compensate for lack of weight.

 

People traditionally viewed as ATGs have been people who at the very least were able to dominate their divisions for an extended period and establish themselves as the best in the world why would the criteria be different for Foreman?

 

Fair point. But what about Holyfield? In the years 90/91 you could claim he was best in the world --suspiciously, having not yet fought Tyson, Bowe, or Lewis-- which is no longer a span than Foreman's 73/74 span. Yet some people have him ranked in their top 5 all time.

Personally I think it's quite easy to pick apart anyone's resume, including Ali and Louis'. These guys all have chinks in their histories, things one can criticize and raise suspicion over. Personally I think George would steamroll 90 percent of past heavyweight champions.

 

Quit ducking. I already addressed this. And vitali never established himself as the best of his era on your dumbass list.

Foreman was 3-1 against fellow ATGs and was denied a rematch despite ranking #1 and winning fight of the year in his come back.

Half the guys on your list (louis, tyson, liston, vitali) had losing records against fellow atgs. And none regained the lineal belt like foreman did.

 

Louis does not have a losing record against ATGs in his prime. His losses past his best are irrelevant.

 

Foreman's reach is just half inch shorter than Vitali Klitchko's.
And one and a half inches longer than Brewster's and Sanders,both of whom ko'd Wlad.
It is also three and a half inches longer than Povetkin's, and he is one and a half inches taller than Povetkin.
It's also two and a half inches longer than Joseph Parker's.
And half inch longer than both Jarrell Miller's and Dillian Whyte's.