George Foreman Vs Rocky Maricano

I don't see how you can agree on the one hand that Rocky got hit by every world class opponent he ever met and then on the other, dismiss the notion that George Foreman, who has a world-class offence, was likely to hit him. In his prime, Foreman hit everyone he faced, including Muhammad Ali, who was much, much, much harder to hit clean than Marciano - I can't stress this enough - even on the ropes, leaning back, Ali was harder to hit clean than Marciano was, by distance - and guess what, Foreman managed it. This idea that you have that Marciano is defensively too good for Foreman is nonsense, and every scrap of film that exists on either one of these fighters demonstrates that clearly.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0RcWezyJm38

Above are highlights of Don ****ell-Rocky Marciano. Because I have better things to do than point out the obvious to someone pretending not to know, I only watched round three; ****ell, who has about a tenth of the offensive talents of Foreman, landed clean at

1:26 (left uppercut to the body)
1:36 (left hook to the head, possibly right-hand to the body)
1:49 (lead right hand to the body)
1:55 (right-left combination to the body)
1:59 (jab upstairs)
2:09 (left uppercut to the jaw)
2:23 (jab upstairs)
2:31 (jab upstairs)
2:37 (jab upstairs)
2:55 (left hook)
3:07 (left hook)
3:24 (counter left-uppercut to the face)
3:35 (right-hook from square as Rocky bores in)

He lands a clean punch for something like every ten seconds they are in the ring together in this round!

Now, we have to accept, in fairness, that as a non-puncher, Marciano might have been treating ****ell differently - we also have to acknowledge that punches that look clean on film might not be (but this works both ways). Even with the caveats it is absolutely clear that Marciano is in no way what you are making him out to be. He was reasonably difficult to pin down for his style, but his style is the most hittable of all. His being hit, often, v Foreman, is inevitable. That's WHY this is the most significant style advantage in the sport.

Nah, bs i'm afraid. My point is that Marciano is at an enormous, collosal, almost insurmountable reach advantage. Your point is that Rocky "knows how to do that", something you've since withdrawn

I said, SPECIFICALLY, that it should be two fighters in a similar class. As a comparison, of course it should be ridiculed.

All of these are pitching an ATG fighter against a good fighter, apart from Satterfield and Valdes, which I think would probably be the best example. This, in turns, underlines how enormously rare and difficult it is to overcome this style advantage in HW boxing

Well, he was, and the fact that you can't see that he was illustrates either your bias or your ignorance. He matched hand-speed with Larry Holmes for Christ sake - surely you don't think that Marciano could do that??

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IupyEYB-27c

Just watch the speed of the jabs in the first twenty-five seconds. I've selected the last round of the hardest fight of Norton's career, and still the speed of hand is notably faster than that of Marciano.

No. I don't accept this at all. I can't think of a single difference you've outlined that is meaningful that I haven't seriously contested and you've failed to rebuke. Sorry. In many ways it's not your inability to argue or anything like that, it's just that what you're saying is desperate and untrue, so it's mostly easy to expose.

Yeah, but really, your claim that Frazier's punch resistance was "worse post-FOTC" hasn't been proven has it? I mean, you have at no time demonstrated that Frazier's punch-resistnace was worse than it was against Bonavena, have you? I mean, Bonavena is what really pegs his punch resistance, not his getting "wobbled" by Bugner?

What you've failed to understand is that Frazier was easier to hit post-FOTC. There is no evidence that his punch resistance was worse than Bonavena at all, is there? IN fact, for the record, I think it was better. I think he took a punch better as he got heavier. It's logical really, and helps to demonstrate how he was able to swallow so many flush bombs in Manilla.

I think you are clearly wrong about this aswell.

Exchanges would occur. Exchanges favour Foreman, too. This is because he's bigger, and a bigger puncher.

 

Why? Why did you "try your best to agree"?

No, you're wrong. I challenge anyone to look at that last right hand and write it off as "not a scoring punch", that is a ludicrous assertion, lots of these punches are just fine, and it's flat out dishonest to pretend otherwise. You can actually see it turn Marciano's head

I'm afraid I have to write you off at this point as a troll again, or someone who just cannot accept the truth of what he is seeing.

I guess you can find just any way you want if you literally make up what you are seeing and then pretend it is real.

 

http://cdn.makeagif.com/media/9-21-2014/IiMzeV.gif

This link is a gif of a punch that choklab doesn't even regard as "a scoring punch." Not only does it score, it looks hurtful, and turns Marciano's head for him. I might do some others if I can be bothered by it's a bit like shovelling **** uphill now.

 

Rocky is NOT moving with it. Are you watching this on a youtube window? I have this fight on a Smart TV. Rocky is only "moving with it" because he's having his head rattled across his shoulders. I am at the point where to make you understand, I not only have to make gifs of individual punches, but put them on slow-motion in order for you to see what is happening. This is ridiculous.

I timecode the punches for you. The punches aren't good enough.

I gif one for you. You conceed that the punch "looks ok" but lie about Rocky anticipating it.

If I put it in slow motion for you - you'll ok that punch, but continue to pretend about all the others (and be right about one or two).

The conclusion - i'd have to make every punch a slow motion gif for you to conceed that Marciano got hit a lot by ****ell I mean, what the ****?

It's not though - it's just the only one i've translated from film to gif in order that even a child could see it was a scoring punch - and you still make up bull**** to downgrade it. It's ubber-trolling, it's crazy level trolling.

 

Maybe start an outreach group?