Yep for those who don't know, way back in 1993, Pro boxer Art Jimmerson took on Royce Gracie (who needs no introduction) Was the same thing, the boxer thinking he will get the grappler out of there, but ended up getting choked out. If anyone believes that a boxer can go in to the cage purely using his boxing skills he will get owned. Check out this video. This dude actually put up more fight than Toney, against a world class Grappler in Gracie. But it seems people need to be reminded that this argument, was resolved a looooong time ago. [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LCsyGduUvzE[/ame]
Oh ****, how could we ever have forgotten about the HOF'er Art Jimmerson? Good point. I think he was on the P4P lists for a good while, wasn't he?
Well he was ranked in the top 10 IBF Light heavy weight rankings. Anyways you are missing the point, Get the number 1 guy in there without take down defense, and submission defence once it hits the ground and you'll see him tap. But what I a saying is that this is nothing new! This match up was done ages ago, and the outcome was there for all to see. In the words of Roy Jones, Ya'll musta forgot lol
That's pretty funny. Do you want me to show you Jimmerson's BoxRec opposition? http://boxrec.com/list_bouts.php?human_id=2044&cat=boxer Orlin Norris is the only name you can even recognize on that list, and he was KO'ed in 4. And you are using this man as a comparison point against Gracie, who is considered on of the best MMA fighters of all time? Not to disagree with your main point about it getting taken to the floor, but your means of getting there is utter shite.
What the hell are you on about. All I am sayng is that the UFC put on boxing V Grappling in it's very first show. And submission was the outcome. So Toney V Couture was nothing that hadn't been done before. The argument was settled right from the off. Even a top 10 boxing guy should have had better boxing skills than a BJJ practitioner with NO boxing skills at all. So your point is irrelevant anyways. Get some comprehension skills you muppet.
It wasn't actually... One fight doesn't settle anything. If the puncher had caught and KO'd Joyce with a punch then it would have also been resolved with the opposite conclusion?
This is where you fail miserably. Do you really think Jimmerson was a "top 10 boxing guy?" If you do, you quite clearly never followed boxing, nor have any inclination how little being ranked in the top 10 by the IBF really means. Clearly, you are the one with the comprehension issues in using a comparison of a club -level boxer with Royce Gracie? And you think this settles a dispute in any way?
Art J didn't want to take the fight when he found out what it really was. He then wore one glove to protect his jabbing hand.
Idiot! you fail by not watching the video, the commentator said that Jimmerson was rated at 10 by the IBF. You think i just pulled that figure from thin air?? Again as dumb as you seem to be, a boxer rated at number 10 by any org should be more than capable of beating a BJJ guy with no boxing or striking to epeak of. SO if what you are getting at is bring a better boxer to the cage and you'll see a better outcome for the boxer, then you are talking total ****. Without a ground game and TD defense, he won't last long. And I probably know more about boxing than you do.
Two things: If you really and truly knew anything about boxing, you'd know being ranked #10 by the IBF means absolutely **** ALL. Rankings in the alphabet organizations are largely politically motivated and are some of the most corrupt you will ever see. If you know ANYTHING about the sport, you should know that. If you honestly think Jimmerson was a top-10 LHW, you should hang your head in shame. Secondly, what did I write in the very first response to your thread? I don't disagree with your analysis on what happens when a boxer gets taken to the ground at all, but using this match as a measuring stick is ridiculous if you're not taking elite from both sides of the equation. Really ****ing simple concept, really.
I dunno about that. I wouldn't take a top 10 rated guy in the IBA or WBF or IBO to beat a BJJ guy with virtually no striking ability. Maybe the Universal Boxing Organization. Universal greatness there.
I'm not saying a top 10 guy from boxing beats a bjj guy, i'm saying the opposite! I'm saying that it doesn't matter where the boxer is rated, but pure boxing alone isn't going to help you much, if a grappler gets a hold of you.
So you think a pure boxer has more than a punchers chance at beating a grappler? If the boxer had to fight the same guy 10 times I'd say he beats him once, and that's with a lucky shot. The Grappler will not trade with him, and get the take down, maybe taking some punishment on the way down, but keeping his senses to go and dominate on the ground. It doesn't make a **** of difference where the boxer is rated in his sport, why cant you get that through your thick head???
Nobody thought this was anything new. MMA is Couture's house. Boxing is Toney's house. In a boxing match it would have ended just as quickly the other way. This is just common sense.