Great article on Oscar-JCC, Canelo-JCC Jr

At some point Chavez Sr. needed to admit that his kid ain't ****. Hell his kid ain't biologically his, but Jr really ain't **** and never was gonna be anything but a spoiled man-child. That's Sr. fault that he is the way he is because that's the person he raised into adulthood.
He should have stayed with Arum because Arum was making this lazy bum work for his earnings. Haymon getting him was nothing more than a welfare program where they would both get paid off his father's name whether he earned it or not.

 

There is a moral here,weight bullies are ok so long as they can do it.

 

Gr8 Article. SO much to say here.
1. I remember getting a VHS copy of a skinny DLH and seemingly buffed Mosley sparring for JCC Sr.. DLH boxing sweet, then at one point- wham! Drops.

2. The history revisited here is just enough to identify the culture wars we see today.
JCC is to Ali, what DLH is to Moneymay.

ALi & JCC were imo 2 men too proud to bow to a new culture- just wanting to be accepted as fighters, chasing glory.
(DLH , like PBF) 2 stars chasing the money...hoping--Glory would follow.

I always admired JCC and Duran who just never cared to learn the language- If they lived in the states, different story.
Had DLH IMO compromised...and spent more time going back home, going to the hoods in Mexico, he may have eased some of the tensions?

As far as Jcc Jr. Most kids of greats never reach a status, just too hard. Plus he didn't grow up in box cars. He didn't sleep on pissed-stained mattresses, so his machismo was never proven.

And all that gladiator talk imo is B.S. JCC was NEVER a club fighting blood thirsty warrior. He was a masterful inside fighter with technical precision. Every punch was well placed, his footwork a thing of beauty. Not a dirty fighter. DLH did himself in with that I'm not a fighter stuff.

I remember taking a few pictures of the great JCC. He was sitting in a ring, talking with ESPN and he turned saw me...gave me a stare. Damn! LOL!
It wasn't the stare of a man looking to be a badazz. It was the stare of someone who was born to do what he did. No daddy made him do that..he's just something Jcc Jr, nor Oscar nor Floyd could ever be: A natural born warrior. Thats why Junior per this article started chomping on pizza after his loss...

 

Too much hyperbole for my taste by good nonetheless.

 

As far as JCCjr, he was never going to come remotely close to what hid father achieved, yes the nostalgic MXs stood behind the son of El Gran Campeon, and hoped the best for him, but it was evident early on he lacked the natural gifts and discipline to emulate his father. I supported JCCjr through the good and the bad until he performed the way he did against Canelo,that fight was the final nail in his boxing coffin as he proved he had played the very same Mexicans that supported him through his shenanigans and was ONLY there for the paycheck.

I started following boxing closely around the time DLH was reaching his prime. One thing that stood out for me was that he was constantly reaching new levels. While I agree he was pursuing the "money", he clearly believed the way to attain the money was by fighting the best, which his career is a testament of that. ODLH is a throwback fighter in the sense that he wanted to fight the best to prove he was the best. ODLH assimilated well to being a star and boxing icon, which helped him along with his boyish charm and good looks to crossover into the mainstream.

You incorrect about ODLH not returning to his community though. For one, he is not from Mexico and I'm pretty sure he has never lived in Mexico. ODLH was born and raised in East Los Angeles, and did return and has given millions upon millions in return. There is a long list of charity that he has done for East Los Angeles. From renovating White Memorial Hospital where his mother was a patient, buying several buses so that patients without transporatation can get to and from the hospital, to opening a Charter High School for underprivileged kids looking for quality education. Not too mention all the food drives, and the boxing gym he opened for his Boyle Heights community.

While Mexicans and Mexican American have a similar culture, the upbringing is different. In Mexico you have far less opportunities for success than someone born and raised in the U.S., but the roads both men (ODLH and JCC) took were similar in the sense that both needed to do something to get out of a bad environment, and both men sacrificed most if not all of their youth to achieve what they did.

I consider both men true warriors and great representation of what it is to start from the bottom go through the struggles and sacrifices, and reach the very top.

 

Gr8 response.
Let me uh, not correct, but clarify-A .
I agree with you that he sought to fight the best. He never tried to unify- but he never left a division without fighting the best- JCC, SweePea, Tito.
Returning home to East L.A. and reaching back.. based on your response, I can see why he kinda got frustrated with the argument is he Mexican or not. All that giving..from the heart
My dis' on DLH is he played into Arum's idea of what he should be and not what Oscar thought Oscar should be- Again- I'm using this article as the basis.

As far as Mexico. I disagree with you sir. Not being born in Mexico, doesn't mean one can't go back and discover their roots. Ali going back to Africa gr8 example; he didn't stay cooked up in the hotel like Forman did..he went into the slums -side note did U know Rocky got his scene of running with the kids from the docu of Ali? Ali even pranked him and came onstage and accused him of stealing his story...but I digress, my bad!!
Point is...DLH should've never expected a nation that didn't know him to love him. Unless he did visit Mexico and they dogged him too?

Mexicans here were angry when he came to the ring with a Mariachi group, remember? A Mexican bruh' I know explained it to me like this:
It's like a black dude born in a so-so hood, gets paid. Moves to a mansion, listens to R& B- Beyonce, Bruno Mars
Then he comes to the ring with Chuck D and Public Enemy hollering FIGHT THE POWER.
He played himself!
He may have done (some) good for his people, but distancing himself from a warrior--claiming to be a boxer? Man that was the ultimate insult! Tell Ruben Olivares, Carlos Zarate, Salvador Sanchez, Miguel Canto, Daniel Zaragoza---they weren't boxers. Just warriors.
The best warriors are boxers...who can war if need be.
I see your point, b. Oscar was mas macho in the ring..but based on that article- some politics & culture issues is what drove his people away. JMM is an expert boxer...but he prefers to speak the language of his people and not tell his people to speak anything other...again- for Mexico not USA!

 

what a surprise!! Only took about a decade for you to find your second boxer to follow religiously...

 

While the article does give a good account of certain moments in ODLHs career, its also full of hyperbole and I don't think the feeling its trying to convey is very accurate. While I do feel that ODLH a son of Mexican immigrants did want to earn the respect of an entire nation which would equate to more fame and more money which is what every fighter is ultimately after, I don't think he was bothered too much about it, probably the reason why he didn't bother to "Go to Mexico and parade himself over there". His community is East L.A. and when he thought of giving back it was to East L.A., his home town.

Something most Non-Mexicans do not understand is that there is a subtle but real rivalry between Mexicans and Mexican-Americans, has been for a very long time. Many Mexicans do not consider Mexican Americans to be "real" Mexicans, and consider MX-AM to be riviliaged and spoiled, and its understandable. While some of the culture and traditions are similar and the same, a lot of the struggles and upbringings are different. Mexicans even have somewhat derogatory nicknames for MX-AM and vice versa.

The JCC-ODLH fight was the epitome of this rivalry. It was the most popular Mexican ever boxer vs the most popular Mexican-American boxer ever, and sides were taken. Needless to say when the "privileged" Mex-American prevailed over the legendary national hero, emotions were inflamed.

ODLH was and continues to be a hero in his "hometown" of Los Angeles. There is even a statue of him at Staples Center in downtown L.A. even though he only fought there once.

In 2018 ODLH is now almost fully accepted by the Mexican community. There was a very good article I read a few months back on how the Mexican community has finally embraced ODLH. According to the article one of the key factors for Mexicans finally embracing Oscar and claiming him as one of their own is because a lot of the JCCsr fanatics at the time have now had children born in the U.S. and now can relate and understand ODLH's struggle hrough their now MX-American children. If I find the article I will post it here later on.

 

Great article!
Thanks for sharing!!!

 

Being brought up on British boxing to see Oscar for the first time was like seeing something from outta space.
I got talking to a friend the other day who I had no idea was into boxing and he said the same thing and he still has videos of Oscar,Morales and Barrera from back in the day.
Britain is the place where most sports were invented but we stayed put in 19th century,one of my bug bears is English coaching methods,same in cricket or boxing in that anyone who shows to be a bit unorthodox we have to coach it out of em instead of harnessing what it is that got em so far to begin with.
I don’t know about you but every time I watched ODH fight he always seemed to be on the wrong side of decisions and he took it so well.

JCC jnr with his size could never hope to capture what his dad had which was raw untamed skill with freaky power in both hands,the son probably by using PEDs was too much of a weight bully which is fine until the time comes that you can’t do it anymore and suddenly you have to fight guys as big as oneself.

 

It used to confuse me Isal watching Oscar as I couldn’t work out if he was an all American hero or the Mexican star boxer but I think you’ve cleared that one up.

 

He’s been a secret fan of GGG from the start me thinks

 

JCC jr managed to become world champion, had few championship fights. That is quiet an achievment to be honest. He is no all time great, but what he accomplished is really, really good, most boxers would dream to have the carreer he had.

 

I applaud you on what you said about the Mexican and Mexican American culture being different. I've had my share of discussions from other Chicanos/Pochos who get upset at the fact that I tell them I and them are not Mexicans, real Mexicans at least. And you just nailed it in your description. And it's true, we Mexican Americans are a totally different culture from the Mexican culture. Specially for the majority of Chicanos (like you said of ODLH) that have never experienced life in Mexico.

That's why in Mexico among Mexicans when the discussion of the best Mexican boxers comes up, ODLH is no where to be mentioned.

Hats off to you!