Great fight! Charlie Powell vs Norkus

Come on Edward, I even put the nba ratings in there

Valdes was higher than Cooper

 

No these rankings, especially the NBA were put together AFTER Cooper beat Foley


Ahhh here come the conspiracy cries from choke! Denial and excuses!


Stick to hating on sonny Liston


The reason why you joined the forum eh?

 

That speaks volumes, that a young Liston was willing to get in the ring with a seasoned world class fighter like Johnson in 56

 

"Folley had a top 3 rating 1957-1959"

Okay.

"and a top 5 rating 1960-1964"

So we are back to talking about the future. No one knew in 1958 what the ratings would be in 1964.

 

Dundee himself said pastrano couldn’t handle the bigger men. Didn’t hit hard enough to keep them off him. Guys like valdes would have swarmed all over Willie like a swarm of bees and mauled him to death like he did Charles..Williams and Liston would have killed pastrano

Pastrano was best suited for 175



I think you underrate Foley’s victories over Valdes and bethea.

Bethea was highly rated in 56. He had defeated Ezzard Charles (your big on over the hill names), Joe Bygraves (knocked out Henry Cooper) , jimmy slade (coming off a win over hurricane Jackson)

After Folley beat Valdes. Nino would go on a 12-1 run with 5 victories over ring top 10

 

Don’t forget Johannson ran away from Liston. Wanted no part of him.

Liston dismantles Johannson early in 1959

 

Honestly,

Cooper was not durable, having a so-so chin, and of course was very vulnerable to cuts, but he was tallish, fast, and an excellent boxer with a great left. Folley is a solid boxer but looks slower both of hand and foot.

We're not seeing the whole fight but off what we see here I would have Cooper winning. His was out-jabbing Folley.

Cooper didn't seem hurt much at the knockdown. He got turned around and Folley hit him in the back of the head.

Just overall, these two are really classy boxers and fun to watch.

 

Folley dominated, absolutely dominated Cooper in the rematch. Outboxed and had him reeling in the first then iced him cold in the 2nd round


"Henry Cooper was knocked out by Zora Folley at 1:06 of the 2nd round in a scheduled 10 round bout at Wembley Indoor Stadium Tusday night. Cooper was reeling after the 1st round and bleeding freely from cuts over his left eye and on his forehead. Folley was right on top of him when the 2nd round began and ended it all with a crashing right hook to the jaw. Cooper got up to one knee just as the count reached ten." -Associated Press

Yeah, of course damato didn’t give either guys a title shot

 

Like I posted earlier,

the case for Folley is that he once beat Valdes who was now doing the heavy lifting of beating contenders while Folley was padding his record with guys that make Pastrano's resume look like a murderer's row.

Johnny Hollins anyone? J D Harvey? Jimmy Woods? A couple of faded has-beens would have been a big step up.

In fairness, off what that 1962 Sports Illustrated article says, Johansson had not even watched a film of Liston up to that time. Off what I remember, Ingo was more into appearing on TV with Dinah Shore and Perry Como than he was into paying attention to what was happening among the contenders. He was even the mystery guest on What's My Line the night before the Patterson rematch. Because we boxing fans are so interested in who is coming or going in the ratings, we assume the active boxers are. But Euro boxers probably aren't reading our magazines and newspapers and so might be surprisingly uninformed about this or that contender. Even one as prominent as Sonny.

 

So Doug Jones KO'ing Folley in their rematch proves he was better than Folley in their first fight also?

Is that your position?

 

Come on...Johansson was scared shitless of Liston. And he would have been lucky to make it out of the first round in 1959 with that weak jaw of his

 

Big difference between the two..have you seen both fights? Their on film. In the Cooper rematch, Folley dominates him from start to finish blows him away Frazier foreman esq. in Jones Folley fight, Jones was lucky to make it out of the first round nearly knocked out. Then he was outboxed for the next several rounds. He caught Folley, who like Cooper had a shaky chin. But I had Folley ahead 5 rounds to 1


I take a fighters overall body of work to rate them

Folley had the better career than Henry Cooper by a large margin


From 1956-1965 name me more than 5 heavyweights who had better careers than Zora Folley? You probably can’t

Folley accomplished it all...a number 1 ranking by both RING and NBA. Big quality win (Eddie Machen 1960), incredible depth to his resume....beat Bob Foster, Henry Cooper, Oscar Bonavena, George Chuvalo, Bob Cleroux, Mike De John, Doug Jones, Nino Valdes, Wayne Bethea, Paul Andrews, Willi Besmanoff , Billy Daniels, Alonzo Johnson, Alex Miteff, Joe Bygraves, robbery against mildenberger

You love to promote Lee savold because of how many top 10 men he Beat. What about Folley here?


Your bashing of Zora Folley is baffling to me.

 

Ali even gave a washed up 35 year old Folley a sympathy title shot in 67 because Ali said Folley was ducked all those years in his prime. From Ali himself