Agreed. I think I have Liston Top 5 or 6 H2H. Now who ranks higher H2H between the Klit Bros is tough - Vitali didn't beat as many diverse opponents as Wlad and wasn't as skilled but was obviously the tougher brother. Who you got?
V and W are the basically same letter after being translated into English. Wlad and Vlad are the same guy. Both K bros are better than Liston h2h and accomplished more.
Hmm that’s a tough one. Off the top of my head, my top 5 H2H are Ali, Liston, Tyson, Foreman, and Holmes (not in order) Louis was on it, but I downgraded him a bit after reassessing his resume, and the struggles he had with less than stellar competition. Fury was also up there (though not quite top five) but I can't help but feel he's a bit overrated. As I said to Rules a couple days ago, many here say Fury is the H2H goat, or at least the top 5 while also saying Wilder is terrible..... even though Wilder gave Fury hell on two out of three occasions, dropped him 4 times, and came close dangerously close to knocking him out on at least four occasions. Years ago I had Vitali ahead of Wlad but now hmmmm idk. Vitali is a bit difficult for me to assess, because in both his losses he was hampered by an injury or a cut so major weaknesses (besides cuts obviously and possibly being injury-prone) are vague. He had a much better chin than Wlad that's for sure. Wlad was by far more skilled, beat a wider range of opponents, and had longevity on his side. Chris Byrd, who fought the Klitschko’s back to back, compares their skills: Chris said Wlad Klitschko was the harder puncher but was also nowhere near as tough as his brother had the inferior inside game,, and surprisingly, Byrd says Vitali was the superior technical boxer (though I think this part may be hyping up the brother he beat as opposed to the one he lost to) Chris Byrd says Wlad used his jab and grab to protect his chin, whereas Vitali, who's chin was rock solid, would just tee off on an opponent, without worrying about taking a shot. Gun to my head, I think Vitali was the better fighter, if not the more proven fighter H2H.
What’s the point of having Liston in the top 5 h2h? Machen, Folley, and Patterson would all be cruisers or light heavyweights today. He underperformed horribly in two chances against Ali. Nino would go nowhere in today’s division. Beating Cleveland Williams isn’t even on par with beating Tony Tucker.
1. I'm fairly certain his biggest fight wasn't held in a throwaway gym with an audience of just over 2000. 2. The knockdown was not a genuine one imo. 3. How old was he at the time? He was at minimum 35 years old, and if one goes by the 1950 census records, he was 43 years old! Doctors estimated his actual age at the time to be 39 to 42.
Wladimir=Volodymyr~Vladimir Take it from a guy with basically the exact same name. Neither Vitali nor Wladimir would ever go by "Vlad" or "Wlad" in Russia. No idea why you think Vitali would go by Vlad.
1. Liston 2. Patterson 3. Michael Spinks 4. Carl Williams 5. Golota That's the all time rankings for heavyweight who got put on the deck in round one of the biggest fight of their career. Liston's mother would be proud.
