greater Middleweight, Greb or SRR?

No fighter is unbeatable, your bound to lose by law of average's when fighting so often against the best in the world, wheather it be because of an off night or for whatever reason.

But if someone asked me who's the one guy that I would'nt bet against at their best at welterweight and middleweight,

Then my answer would be Sugar Ray Robinson.

 

Of course Robinson was not in the same weight class of carles, Moore, Marshall and Johnson, just as Harry Greb was NOT in the same weight class as Tunney, Gibbons, Loughran, Dillon, Levinsky, Rosenbloom etc...
But, Greb TACKLED them and beat them often..Something that Robinson
NEVER ATTEMPTED...You just PROVED my point, but you cannot viscerally ADMIT it !
For you to state thyat Greb 'couldn't whip "HALF" of his opponents of his size, does not deserve a response,to such a flagrant UNTRUTH..
Oh, yes, and the world is flat !

 

1. Greb was as happy campaigning at LHW as he was MW, didnt have a size disadvantage in most fights as a LHW once weighing 173lbs, and actually outweighed the likes of Loughran, just like Robinson campaigned from lightweight-middleweight, Greb campaigned MW-LHW and a few cruserweights to boot

2. Greb wasnt dominating the best fighters his own size, he went 2-2 with T Gibbons, 1-1 with Mike Gibbons, 1-2 against Tiger Flowers, 0-1 against O'Dowd, 4-2-1 against Loughran (who was only 19 for their first fight and outweighed)

Those are the cold hard facts

 

Greb was a middleweight who when NECESSARY weighed about 158-9 for his bout Mickey Walker in 1925, one year before he died...
i guaratee Robinson when he was a middleweight walked around at 165
and over..And were he to have fought Charles, Moore etc would weigh
that ...Why drain yourself when you dont have to ?

 

Not a chance, Robinson's average weigh in weight for middeweight fights was 154 - 57 Ibs

thats completely false saying his walking around weight was 165, in his prime years at middleweight, it was no higher 158.

 

You left out a few cold hard facts.

in all Harry Greb defeated 14 lineal world champions.

6 middleweight champions whose title reigns ranged from 1913-1931 (18 years).

7 light heavtyweight champions whose title reigns ranged from 1914-1934 (20 years).

I guess he wasnt going to be in his priime for all of these fights.

While fighters like Gibbons O'Dowd and Flowers might look OK against him based on the numbers of their series, their overall records vs fighters of the era are not even close.

A lot of their sucess against him is simply atributable to Grebs level of activity and the sheer number of world class oponents he fought.

If Greb walked on water, you would probably cite it as evidence that he couldnt swim.

 

You began your post with a false assumption.

Are you aware of his body of work? Are you aware of how many Hall of Famers he beat?

Do you box? Get in the ring tomorrow with a patch over your right eye. Then you'll see how much it would detract from any fighter.

His vision was impaired in his left eye and he may have been legally blind in that eye. Greb's right eye was stone blind for many, many fights during a tougher era against rougher men. Either way, no one said that Greb was the greatest MW because he was blind in one eye for his last 50-odd fights, so please stop throwing up straw man arguments. Look at the total picture.

As per Joe and Harry...

Joe had 37 fights total over his whole professional career. Greb fought 45 times in one year.

...Think about it, PowerPuncher.

 

I think what you said is worth alot! I remember that your Dad saw both Robby and Greb in their primes and no one else can touch that here,,,,so its a very valuable addition you bring and I thank you for it friend.

 

Ive thought the fights Greb had with the Gibbons brothers might gauge him with others in history. Dead equal in wins and losses with them the Gibbons were master boxers who were not set punchers, trying to move their positions and feet almost constantly. Robbys fighting style makes this interesting as he usually was moving away from the trenches also but could ko a man with both hands to the head and body unlike Mke and Tommy. That said I can't make much of a guess who was the better, Fleisher thought it was Robby and Burts Dad thought it was Greb and both of them saw them fight. Nuff said.

 

Salsanchez fan on the first page is right, i don't see the issue with what he's saying there.

 

Thanks for your poist T, but you are Dead wrong when you cite that
Nat Fleischer had Robinson over Greb at middleweight..Dead wrong...
Fleischer, who saw them both in their primes, and whoise BOOKS and
opinions I have NEVER ONCE had Robinson at 160 over Harry Greb..
Fleischer had Ketchel, Tommy Ryan ,HARRY GREB, Mickey Walker,
followed by Ray Robinson, in that order, and near the end of
Nat,s life he had Greb over Stanley Ketchel...This statement I make
is a fact, not an opinion...b.b.

 

I wasn't limiting it to back-foot punching performances, but off the cuff I'd say Jones-Toney as such an example. Clay-Liston is another.

 

x2

 

Interesting. Thanks!

 

Great shout. I think that's a good an all-round punching performances as anything really. People harp on about Jones' defensive reflexes, but his ability to sharp-shoot any target with the kind of speed and power he did was probably his biggest asset.