Greb beat better fighters than Robinson!

If pink flamingo is going to criticise Greb's victories over Smith and McGoorty, or his opposition in general, then he must also take away from Darcy's accomplishments given that Darcy made his name fighting many of the same men Greb fought and he did it in his own back yard in fights where every advantage was his. Thats my point. Hes a dark horse alright but its because given some of the difficulty he had in fights such as holland, smith, and brown, and the alleged betting fixes that were common practice in australia such as clabby, mcgoorty, and crouse, there are big questions about him that were never answered due to his death. If Tyson had died in 1989 he would be in a similar position.

 

I agree. At middleweight Robinson lost a lot of fights and he wouldn;t have a chance with a top heavyweight.

http://www.amazon.com/Joe-Gans-Biography-American-Champion/dp/0786439947/ref=pd_bxgy_b_img_b

 

It is considerably more likely that the word of flamengo is rubbish.

 

Quoted for truth.

 

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-5'8, 158~170, beat every heavyweight who was willing to fight him.

He was almost regularly outweighed by 20 or 30 pounds. He'd fight a MW, then a LHW a week later and then another MW and a HW within the next month. He fought guys who were 6'5 and 40 lbs heavier and he'd exchange with them, take their shots, and win the bout with a scratch.

His last 72 fights were fought with one eye. By 1923, he was blind in his right eye. Totally blind. And he's in the ring with terrors like Norfolk, Flowers, Gibbons, Tunney, Loughren, Mickey Walker and young lions like Marullo, Jimmy Delaney, Slattery, and Maxie Rosenbloom!

...You can't take anything away from him.

He handled Dempsey -easily- in sparring. Dempsey couldn't find him. And these sparring sessions weren't your normal kind. He went a total of 18 rounds with Dempsey and no one thought Dempsey would handle Greb with ease -some doubted that he'd even handle him at all. On July 29, 1920, Greb split Dempsey's eye. The session was stopped -by some accounts by Dempsey. Two days later, he's fighting Tommy Gibbons, who's campaigning as a HW. Gibbons was undefeated in about 55 fights. An undefeated, all time great. Greb beat him handily.

Gibbons, the loser, got the shot against Dempsey.

What do these fellas have in common? Tunney, Miske, Willie Meehan, Gunboat Smith, Gibbons, Darcy, Terry Kellar, Battling Levinsky, Joe Bonds, Bill Brennan, and Homer Smith? Dempsey fought them... and Greb did too. Greb posts wins over them ALL. He beat Brennan about 4 times, Smith twice, Levinsky 6 times, Meehan twice -one time entering the ring with a black eye and boils on him and still whipped him almost every round. Meehan went 2-1-2 against Dempsey. Greb fought HWs who Dempsey didn't fight and he fought Dempsey's sparring partners.

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--And here's the thing: Greb was a MW who fought and beat a Who's Who of ATG Light Heavies. Tunney. Kid Norfolk. Gibbons. Loughren. Add Mickey Walker, Tiger Flowers, Billy Miske, and Jack Blackburn (who Greb fought in his 30th bout) in there and Greb is indeed looking better in terms of resume than Robinson.

 

Good post stonehands, do you think Wills does a Norfolk to Greb? Kid Norfolk beat Greb, and Wills slaughtered Norfolk in two.

 

Norfolk didn't have Greb's chin.

 

Sure, but norfolk's defense was harder to penetrate than greb's

 

Norfolk lost the first one albeit a newspaper decision. Greb won in the accounts that I have seen, although it may have cost him his eye. That one seems to have been the fight where Greb suffered a retinal tear. Incidentally, Norfolk may have lost the sight in his left eye the same year against Lee Anderson.

Greb was disqualified in the second Norfolk one, although he probably should not have been. That one was in the Mechanic's Building right on the corner of Charles Street and St. James if you know the area.

I'm extremely impressed with Greb's willingness to fight Kid Norfolk, never mind the point that Greb seems to have handled him -although outweighed by 17 pounds.

Keep in mind that Wills outweighed Norfolk by a full 35 lbs and had a 4-5 inch height advantage. Norfolk was a demon. He was a superb counter puncher, very strong, and very skilled.

Greb had a style that seemed to be designed to handle almost any other style. He was a master of angles, had speed to spare, could fight inside and outside, and actually outboxed Gibbons from the outside, his stamina was off the charts, he was as agile a fighter as there ever was, he had a chin like a curbstone, would fight anyone, anytime, and had unbelievable experience.

You'd have to favor the much larger Wills, but I wouldn't bet a dime on it. And I do not see Wills stopping Greb.

 

-not so sure about that. Greb would emerge from what seemed to be vicious battles unmarked. Tunney I and Walker among them.

 

I don't have them, but i've seen them on ESB here.

Well, my point is, you're counting two close fights as undisputed Greb victories which is unfair in my opinion.

Really? Let's see the list of the 125 contenders or champions that Greb beat, that "easily" outnumber the number of fights Charles had during his entire career. Ring rating didn't start until 1924 of course.

 

Joe Borrell

Billy Miske

Jack Blackburn

Joe Borrell

George Chip

Tommy Gibbons

Kid Graves

George Chip

Jackie Clarke

Willie Brennan

Bob Moha

Joe Borrell

Mike Gibbons

Willie Brennan

Al Mccoy

Jackie Clarke

Jeff Smith

George Chip

Frank Mantell

Jack Dillon

Battling Levinsky

Jeff SMith

Gus Christie

Gus Christie

George Chip

Willie Meehan

Gus Christie

Augie Ratner

Bob Moha

Mike ODowd

Jack Dillon

Mike McTigue

Al McCoy

Bob Moha

Eddie McGoorty

Battling Levinsky

Billy Miske

Leo Houck

Bill Brennan

Battling Levinsky

Leo Houck

Bill Brennan

Billy Miske

Leo Houck

Battling Levinsky

Willie Meehan

Joe Borrell

Mike Gibbons

Bill Brennan

Battling Levinsky

Bill Brennan

Jeff Smith

Battling Levinsky

Mike McTigue

Tommy Gibbons

Bob Moha

Tommy Gibbons

Bob Moha

Gunboat Smith

Bob Moha

Jeff Smith

Jeff Smith

Jack Renault

Jack Renault

Jeff Smith

Kid Norfolk

Charlie Weinert

Jeff Smith

Tommy Gibbons

Gene Tunney

Tommy Loughran

Tommy Loughran

Tommy Loughran

Gene Tunney

Johnny Wilson

Tommy Loughran

Lou Bogash

Bryan Downey

Gene Tunney

Tommy Loughran

Johnny Wilson

Kid Norfolk

Jackie Clarke

Tiger Flowers

Jimmy Slattery

Gene Tunney

Tommy Loughran

Augie Ratner

Jimmy Delaney

Gene Tunney

Johnny Wilson

Mickey Walker

Maxie Rosenbloom

Tony Marullo

Tony Marullo

Jimmy Delaney

Tiger Flowers

Allentown Joe Gans

Tiger Flowers


I dont know how many that is but its damn close to as many fights as Charles had and thats the cream of four divisions of the 10s, 20s, and 30s. I left off a lot of guys that I could have easily included but chose to pick the very top guys.

 

How so?

 

You need to get back to the 'work out' bench pal.

 

Klomps.. I was making a point.

As suggested much earlier, Darcy is a 'no-body' in the eyes of the uneducated Americans, and would have been destroyed by all he met????

Yet, **** me dead!!, suddenly McGoorty and Smith are HOfers...


Trouble with Brown?? Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha
The only trouble with Smith was being hit low.

Holland?? A well schooled man.. who eventuallly succumbed after 3 encounters. Oh, he was of Dutch origan also.