Hagler : Is he Marvelous or Merely Good ?

Don Dunfee later said (1993?) that Hagler was the best middleweight he'd seen

 

just finished hagler-sibson...he was marvelous

 

MARVELOUS.

Head-to-Head, he would have beaten any middle from any era. Others may be rated higher due to competition... Prime Marvin of '85 'twas a monster.

 

I also heard that Marvin was never knocked down as a pro, as an ametuer or in sparring...

 

He does officially hold the record for most successful defenses of the undisputed MW Title. What Moore said about him was very impressive. Unduly and uncharacteristically muted circumspect performances in the draw with Antuofermo, and against Geraldo, Duran and SRL hurt him though, and raise some questions about his mentality under heavy pressure to succeed. He was excellent against Minter and Hearns, but not consistently so in crucial situations. Has a real strong case for best P4P chin of all time.

 

What about guys like Greb, LaMotta, Langford, Fitzsimmons etc who went up and tested their mettle against the big boys? If we're talking middles with undentable chins, sure Hags is great. But p4p is something we can't gauge.

 

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Marvelous

 

So, true. Just look at guys like Klaus or Steele both are rarely ranked in the Top15 but they´ve got the resume to be there. I don´t mind them not beeing there because it´s such a tight and stacked division. And what about guys like Charles or Jones who didn´t do that much there but what they did was amazing. So hard to rank.

Same is true for lw and ww.

At the topic:
Of course he was and still is marvelous. His passport says so. :deal

 

This sounds iffy to me, Duodenum.

 

Top 3, definitely top 5.

LoL at Billy Conn's comments. I liked Moore's remark on the matter. Pretty balanced. Cerdan is pretty highly rated. LaMotta, who I love as a fighter, appears to be slightly overrated. He tested himself against the best of the best, though.

 

Hagler and Carlos Monzon were definitely the best ever middleweights of all time,imo. Hard to split them.
I rank Sugar Ray Robinson as number 3 at that weight. Ray was nigh unbeatable at welter,but I'd take Marvin and Carlos to beat him at the higher poundage.

 

I have never understood this...I think people must rate the win over hearns (a good win) alot higher than me. For my Money 1980 vs Minter is the best Hagler ever to step in the ring! I would say 80- mid 83 being the prime version and the 85 being a still very good version, but not the Prime Hagler!

 

He did a good job of being the bigger and younger man against Duran, consistently standing his ground and asserting himself as SRL couldn't do in Montreal, repeatedly making Roberto bounce back to the ropes and concede territory. (I don't think Hagler was as physically strong as his musculature suggested, but he did portray block of granite immovability in this particular situation.)

Maybe El Cholo would have stood up to Marv's "Destruct and Destroy" mode the way he later stood up to Barkley's fire, but Hagler didn't test him the way Hearns would. Marv was utterly moribund in his swan song, displaying little urgency and fire. Where was the desperate and savage beast we saw dispatch Minter and Hearns so viciously? Why did his performance drop off so much in Antuofermo I, Geraldo, Duran and SRL? These were extremely critical matches, and he didn't measure up.

 

What a load of **** the old timers talk. Hagler isnt top ten, hes fought in a weak era and so on

Good on Archie Moore and DOn DUnphy for giving a very sensible outlook