Haglers 12 defenses

He certainly cleaned his division out. Great champion.

 

Marvin in 1987 was not close to the fighter he was in 1980-1985. Inactivity was not something he should have done. He had so many fights, that once he was inactive before the Mugabi fight it showed in the fight. He was slow and unsharp. He was a guy who should have always had 2-3 fights a year, or he would not be that great. And I think he reached a pinnacle with Thomas Hearns which he never could reach again. He put it all out against Hearns in 1985, and might have left something in the ring. Not as much physical but mental.

 

Marvin was slipping before the Mugabi fight, but I think the Hagler/Mugabi fight seriously diminished his abilities. It was a long war that would have took something out of anybody. Mugabi was never the same, either. Hagler took a boatload of punishment in that fight, and he was marketedly slower after that fight. Yes, the layup affected him, but he couldn't let his hands go in the ninth when he had SRL where he wanted him. If that was an 85 Hagler, he would have stopped Leonard.

 

Lets cut to the chase, nobody else fought him. In that whole run he never once fought outside Italy, Venesuela, Mexico and one or two other minor stadiums vs various no names. The middleweight division during Haglers reign was woeful, made worse by such a dominant champion willing to take on all and sundry.

 

Hamsho would have lost to al, he was built up by Madison Square Garden. His biggest win was agaisnt Young Bobby Chyz, who totally froze up when they fought. Hamsho was the Yuri Foreman/John Duddy of his day.

 

Caveman Lee was worst opponent. Plus he tested positive for opiates and morphine after bout. He was ko'd in one.

 

check this out on Lee http://www.eastsideboxing.com/forum/showthread.php?t=280669

 

what I liked about Marvin he took on the best of his times and most of his number 1 contenders something Holmes and others did not do in the era...Marvin and the Petronelli's fought everyone with confidence of victory...they got outsmarted by Angelo and SRL but Angelo was a master of the EDGE and at it for some time

 

Hagler's single weakness was his mind ... he had some huge issues and Ray played him perfectly ...

first off Ray was the younger man for their fight ... of course he had been inactive but Marvin was showing a hell of a lot of wear and tear by the time they fought ... he was getting hit far more but most importantly he was much slower ... He was getting hit by Mugabi, Roldan and of course Hearns ... simply no where near the same guy who destroyed Miinter and Vito in the rematch .. He was hustled by Leonard ... he gave up glove size, ring size and other elements that who have helped him simply because Ray gave him the bigger purse which was HUGE for Marvin's ego and inferiority complex ... the rest is history .. in my opinion the Hagler that fought Minter destroys the Leonard that defeated Hearns or Kalule ...

 

I love Marvin, but he would always have trouble with Leonard. I do think the Hagler of 1983-1985 has a better chance to stop Leonard than even the earlier one. 1987 Hagler was just too inactive and rusty to beat Ray.

 

Obel was probably the most undeserving challenger, he only really beat Park.Obviously some nice backing from the alphabets.

He wasn't that bad a fighter though and middleweight was never woeful, it wasn't until the late 90s that it dried up.Before then even at worst there were plenty of competent solid fighters around at one time and usually a lot of damn good ones too.

 

I also think Ray always would have given Marv trouble. He knew how to get inside Hagler's head, disarming Marv for years with flattery and expressions of being intimidated by Hagler. He applied the same mental akido Duran used before his match with Palomino (where Carlos was expecting a bully, and got a friendly handshake and request for his autograph instead). SRL knew what buttons to push. Ray was one of the shrewdest performers in all of sports.

 

Which is ironic because Duran is the one who taught Ray to use outside tactics to help him in the ring later.

 

Quite remember the reasons but he had massive backing from one of the big alphabet boys. He did nothing.

He was a decent fighter, but if the 160's weren't woeful in Hagler's defense era they were certainly weak imo. No challenger put himself above the pack or cut any swathe to a challenge whatsoever. Consistency for most of them was only found in the dictionary. Anytime one of them showed a bit of promise he quickly bought fans back down to earth. Holmes position was much the same excepting the hype machine that built up a realistically untested but massive punching Cooney. Difference being Hagler sought out the best he could all the way to the end where Holmes avoided fighting a Thomas for e.g.

 

why would Hagler have problems with Ray? Ray can and has been hurt early (Terry Norris proved that!)

a one right hook to the chops would put Sugar out of commision, believe me! not to mention the body shots,,Ray wouldnt want any more of that. Once you got a guy like Leonard hurt the skillz go out the window

Terry Norris proved that!