Has anyone seen LaMotta vs Cerdan?

I know his people ducked Charley Burley (as did practically everyone else)but doesn't the fact that he took on and beat guys like Georgie Abrams(who would lose controversially to Ray Robinson only months later) show that he did in fact prove himself at the highest levels? Abrams was no slouch and according to the primary sources Cerdan beat him clearly(though historical revisionists later tried to say that it was a "controversial decision" due to Georgie's gutsy performance).

 

The point is that he failed to finish the fight. They stopped it for a reason. He supposedly stopped throwing punches. LaMotta could have done the same. Anyone who says that having a broken knuckle isnt painful in friggin boxing match is nuts. I broke two knuckles on my left hand once and damn near feinted from the pain (and I didnt have to go 4 or 5 more rounds punching someone). Floyd Mayweather took the only knee in his life from a broken knuckle/hand. The fact that LaMotta threw so many punches afterwards I think speaks volumes as to who wanted it more. LaMotta had waited years to get a shot at the title. He had been ducked by Zale and passed over in favor of Cerdan (which should tell you something there). Cerdan got the opportunity that LaMotta had and as a result the title. Thats a great amount of motivation. Furthermore you are talking about a guy who in later life punched a brick wall until the knuckles of his hands bunched up inside his hands (thats from LaMotta, not the movie). The guy could indure a great amount of pain, which is one of his trademarks. Lets not play doctor and say simply that because one guy continued fighting and the other didnt that the guy who couldnt finish was suffering from a more severe injury. You cant state that, nobody can now. Like I said, all we know is what happened and the end result is LaMotta TKO.

 

Look, it's the eyewitnesses who say there was "pushing" involved, some say "thrown", some say "half fell, half pushed", some say "half punched, half pushed".
Now, you say "LaMotta bulling in" and they "get tangled and Cerdan goes down".
Yes. Ok.
No one's saying LaMotta should have been docked a point.

The point is, Cerdan went down from untidy scrappy stuff that is not clean boxing, or even clean punching. Sure, it happens and it's part of the game, but still.
(A good referee would certainly try to do something if both fighters were repeatedly going down like that, so there's something not quite right about it.)
Which means his injury likely occured from landing awkward from a fall - a fluke occurence, an accidental fall, or reckless bulling.
Which is unfortunate on Cerdan's part. That's all.

You can say that, but it's a reach into areas we have no idea about. Unless you've been in both their shoes you cannot compare the two injuries.
As far as I'm concerned, both men were warriors of the highest order. Why not give Cerdan the benefit of the doubt ?
I see absolutely no reason not to.

Perhaps because, unlike Vitali Klitschko, Cerdan was getting beaten up and was way behind on points ?

 

Is there any official reports out there on what the actual damage was to LaMotta's hand? We know that it was badly swollen after the fight, but I'm wondering what the extent of the damages were from X-Rays. Because the Detroit News reported "Jake LaMotta's hand doesn't seem to be broken. He'll have his hand X-rayed today, but isn't worried."

 

He ducked a shitload of people both in France and the USA. When lukewarm performances against Abrams and Raadick, two split fights with Dellanoit, and a victory over the novice laverne roach (a mismatch that was universally criticised) is the best you can string together to get a title shot then yeah, Id say he was pretty unproven. People love the Zale fight but conveniently ignore the fact that Zale was on the slide for years before losing to Cerdan (which is the only reason he struggled with Graziano). No, I think its ludicrous to suggest he was as good as robinson or any of the other greats. His resume is glossy as far as win to loss ratio is concerned but there isnt a lot of meat and potatoes there.

 

I'll look a little later. Im going for a swim now. I do seem to recall LaMotta or his people coming up with an x-ray. The photo is enough for me. His hand looked gross.

 

LOL...didn't know you had a weak stomach Steve!

 

Cerdan was a helluva fighter... But, on this night LaMotta would not be denied. And even tough it`s evident that Cerdan wasn`t throwing his left hand as much. Before the `fall` LaMotta was tearing Cerdan up. And lets face it, Cerdan was not going to stop LaMotta with three good hands. LaMotta was much tougher, and as history proved, fought everyone... Watching this I am impressed with LaMotta`s jab (yes jab) how he used it to open up for his body attack. I also was impressed with his tenacity and the speed he had putting his shots together. Over the years always watching him taking it from Robinson, making LaMotta look like a slow moving, slow punching plodder. It was like watching a different LaMotta...

 

You can't assess how this fight would have gone by those initial moments. Jake surprised Cerdan, yes, but Walcott also surprised Rocky Marciano and "tore him up" much more thoroughly than Jake Did Marcel (he floored and tossed Rocky around good, remember?). And I don't even need to mention Archie Moore vs Yvonne Durrell.

Otherwise, you make good points. Jake was a hell of a fighter.

 

Surf, I saw the Cerdan / Abrams fight at MSG in 1946. Remember it well. It was a hard fought battle, but Cerdan won it clearly on sheer aggressiveness.
I thought the decision was fair,though i was rooting for Geogie Abrams.
Three months later I was again rooting against Cerdan, when he stopped a neighbor of mine, Harold Green at MSG. Cerdan was a handsome guy with a lot of charisma....

 

Thanks for the firsthand account, BB. :good