Haye VS Toney

I think Haye wins for sheer speed. Toney is seemingly invulnerable to punches though, so i would be reluctant to bet on a KO.

 

Haye is worse then George Michael. He don't want the fight.

 

It's hard to picture Toney winning this one. Though I am by no means convinced by Haye's opinion of himself, Toney is the more deluded of the two.

Many are beginning to question if Toney isn't being damaged by every additional fight, if not every additional punch. Haye might not be able to stop Toney (potentially, this could have permanent consequences for Toney), but he would overwhelm his smaller, weaker, older opponent.

I think Toney could only win via sheer hard-headed determination AND Haye simply punching himself out against Toney's elbows.

Toney simply isn't George Foreman (totally different career path!).

I'd rather see Haye fight a younger, faster fighter. :deal

regards,

Markus

 

Well put. Toney's an ATG, but I'm pretty sure his time as a serious contender is over.

 

I like Haye quite a bit but he should not fight Toney in his first fight at heavy. My fat man JT may take him to school. Rachman would be the better choice. Lights Out is too slick and a great counter punch and Mr. Haye has no defense for Toney's still nasty counter right hand.

 

Toneys seen better days.

 

James Toney is still a bit ring rusty, but let's say if he stays motivated, gets some good rds under his belt and gets his weight further down before fighting Haye, I think he has enough left to beat Haye.

Let me give you some reasons why I think Toney would beat David Haye:
-Haye has never been in the ring with a defensive master like Toney. Skillwise, Toney owns Haye in every department. So for those who think that Haye can outbox Toney, they just delusional. For every wide Hayemaker David Haye throws (and most probably misses), Toney will land a sharp counter right hand on the wide open Haye.
-Toney is probably the most experienced pro fighter around, at least at HW, he has seen it all. While Haye is still a baby, especially at HW.
-Hayes biggest asset is his punching power, well Toney has never been troubled by that, because firstly you usually don't land flush punches on Toney and secondly if you do, Toney still has an iron chin. So Hayes biggest asset is taken away from him.
-There's no question Haye won't be able to stop Toney, so the fight will go the full 12 rds. Haye has only fought the full 12 rds once before, and he is known to tire in the middle rds.
-Haye is way overrated, too many people catched up with the hype, but seriously David Haye is not the second coming of Lennox Lewis, like the brits want to believe. I mean he is a decent CW, but Toney was already better at CW some years back. Haye is absolutely not tested at HW, his one fight at HW against a journeyman don't mean ****, and having bad defense and a shaky chin spells that he is gonna get exposed and knocked out really soon. Toney might just be the man to do that. Haye has a big mouth, he's overconfident, he can talk the talk but can he walk the walk? I don't think so. Toney at least backs up his thrash talking, and he proved that he can be competitive even with the biggest punchers at HW.

I see Haye taking some early rds, because he's faster at this point than Toney, but still not landing much on James, and then tire in the middle rounds. Toney will begin to land more and more by the middle rds, countering the **** out of Haye, wearing him down and maybe even taking him to school, winning a clear unanimous decision. And since Haye got a weak chin, I can even see Toney winning by TKO in the late rds.

The best thing is that Haye knows this himself, Toney is just too dangerous and too much of a risk for him, even now, Haye is afraid to fight Toney, that's why he is blatantly ducking him now when Toney has openly challenged him and wants to fight a chinless quitter with no heart in Rahman instead. Haye has a big mouth, but he didn't even respond to Toneys challenge, he's as quiet as a mouse.

 

Good post, you made some nice points as you seem to have seen some Toney fights. Interesting thread but because of the recent overruling the fight will probably not take place.

Haye's greatest assets over Toney are obviously his youth and speed. But Toney's style and experience has proved difficult for anyone to handle . Like you said Toney is the more skilled fighter, however I do not know how he will deal with Haye's speed especially as Toney has not seen this kind of quickness since the mid 90's when he was a lightheavy.

 

While Toney may indeed very well be several levels above Haye in the skill department, Haye has something which Toney lacks desperately nowadays: youth, speed and power. Toney hasn't fought a young mobile fighter in quite a while. The last agile opponent he has faced was featherfisted Domminic Guinn (prior that you have to go back to the Griffin fights). All I am saying is that, while I still would narrowly favor Toney over Haye, Haye's high punching might cause him a lot of trouble.

 

Toney doesn't beat Haye. He is cute but Haye isn't some bum with no skills. Hayes speed to power ratio is much better than Toneys. Haye has the height and reach to tear him up. Only thing is Haye can't get carried away and let his punches off or he'll miss and use up valuable energy that keeps him sharp.

 

Toney is a very skilled fighter but cos he's fat, he can't pull off the same things he used to. The weight has ruined his balance and footwork. He can't even tuck his arms in properly, nor can he slip and slip like he used to so his defence has deterioated despite still being very good. His punches are cute but a decent fighter shouldn't succumb to them.

 

While I agree with you that Haye has the speed to trouble Toney, I do not think that James Toney's defense has deterioated much.

It is true that he appeared more hittable in his last bouts (especially the first Rahman and second Peter fight), but he fought real good defensively last July. The way he ducked, rolled and slipped effortless
Rahman punches reminded me a lot of his cruiserwight days.
In my opinion Toney has arguably the best defense in the heavyweight divsion.

 

Difficult one, and styles make fights. I think Haye stands a good chance an KO'ing Wlad based on his explosively fast starts and wouldn't need to worry too much down the stretch as Wlad's workrate wont trouble him... Toney however I think is a tougher one for him.
Toney is savvy as hell and can and will make Haye miss, Haye will tire in this fight (unless being at HW increases all his attributes?) and I could see James stopping him late. On the reverse side I can see Haye outworking James early and James coasting in the 2nd half of the fight thinking he's winning and losing a UD.
What's the chance of Toney being stopped? Well most would believe it impossible, however I think James looked hurt and wobbled a few times in the 2nd Peter fight and dont rate Peter as much of a puncher at the highest level... despite Toney's unreal chin I do think there's a couple of heavies who'd have the power to ice him if they are able to land some clean power shots.

 

I totally agree with you here, Toney is a bit faded but we all saw that he isn't done yet, he still has some fights left. And he looked alright in the Rahman rematch, he still has the best defense in the heavyweight division. I expect him to be even a bit better when he is 10lbs lighter, and that's not impossible.

Haye is fast yes, but he also has stamina issues, so he will be fast in the first rds and maybe win these rds, but he will get tired by the middle rds and then get slower. He has only fought 12rds once, and against a journeyman - can he go twelve rds with a top fighter like Toney and still be fit? I think not. Toney will catch up in the middle rds and wear him down.