Hearns vs Mayweather

When I think of Hearn's opponents, it is Duran that strikes me as the most similar to Mayweather in some ways. Stick with me here!

Duran had moved up pretty successfully from the smaller weights. He was a smart operator, and had educated, if not necessarily fast feet. His defense was subtler to the eye than Mayweathers, but effective, especially in times when he was prepared to box at a Mayweather-esque range (Cuevas fight as an example of some brilliant slipping/rolling). IMO Duran in the modern era, against some of Mayweathers standard of opposition would be almost as hard to hit as Floyd. Duran was similar in stature to Floyd, except for maybe a few inches in reach.

Offensively and stylistically they were worlds apart, although its worth noting that Duran abandoned his swarming style to box more at range against Hearns, especially in the opening minutes. He tended to try and potshot and counter Tommy from the outside, like Floyd would.

Duran got starched in two, and had massive advantages over Floyd. He had knockout power at the weight, a very solid beard, and his workrate and pressure could have folded Tommy IF he'd survived and gotten to him. Floyd was less likely to be reckless and engage, and was quicker of hand, but neither of those were the reasons Duran got knocked out, and he didn't even have the punchers chance that Roberto always had to maybe turn it in his favour.

 

Floyd would get obliterated by Hearns, like most welterweights in history.

 

I dunno Flea. You're right, the Palomino fight would have put Duran up there with the best p4p, but Ray must have been the heavy favourite at Welter. As I have Len as a top 3 welter, Duran's win is all the more impressive

 

Oh Dan, saying Leonard beat Hearns does tell the whole story of the fight. Even if he was 13 rounds up and Ray stopped him, he still stopped him!

 

Na thats too simplistic for me. If we look at Ray the infighter, we see him beaten up by Duran. If we look at ray the boxer, we see him comfortably outboxed by Tommy (I'm being MASSIVELY harsh, as Tommy outboxes EVERY welter in history).

How do you rate him in the grand schemers things Dave? Above Duran p4p? Just below Robinson in the welterweight rankings?

 

Exactly. And yet Ray managed to beat all those guys!

DanielFiasco: great post. Duran was better at everything bar pure speed than Floyd IMO, and was clearly terribly prepared for Tommy nonetheless.

 

Seems to me any adversity Duran comes through he gets merit.

Any Ray comes through and it's proof he wasn't as good :huh

 

In fairness to Floyd, it's a bit like asking how Hagler would have fared against the top light heavies, or how Calzaghe would have done against Holyfield at 190lbs.

Anyone picking Floyd in this fight is either a nuthugger, or has never seen Hearns fight. Or both.

 

Like I said, I think I do give Ray substainal merit. I have him in my top 15, and he is my second best welter ever. Ray's won over Tommy was superb, but he was completely outboxed for the majority, and he looked clueless from rounds 10-12 IIRC.

 

Which actually adds to the performance. You also have to accept his ****ing retina was detached by that point in the fight and Hearns kept belting it with his jab.

You can't say the win was "superb" then take it away with him being outboxed. Yes, he was and, like a true great, he found a way to win. That's really the bottom line.

On their best night, Ray got the win, comprehensively stopping Hearns.

You could pull Duran apart for his capitulation against Ray in the rematch - but being fair stops you doing that.

For the record, I think Duran is greater than Ray due to his longevity and the fact he beat the guy in his prime. I think Ray is better than Tommy overall.

 

On the whole, I sort of agree. I know I'm way to harsh in Ray, probably due to the Catchweight crap he pulled at the end of his career.

As for the Ray - Tommy fight, is it fair to draw comparison to Harrison - Sprott? One guy being totally dominated before the other gassed and was blasted out at the death.

Duran
Leonard




Tommy IMO

But I prefer watching Tommy to Ray

 

By the way, I'm not totally serious on the Harrison - Sprott comparison, I just thought I'd give u and flea a heart attack!

 

I'm half way through Leonard's book at the minute.... What a bellend.

 

Is he as smug with a ghost writer as he seems on screen?

 

Exactly! We can't paint Hearns as this indestructible force that would wipe out most at 147, watch him beat Ray handily throughout the fight only for Leonard to put the shots together (and what shots they were!) and not give Ray an insane amount of credit!