Heavyweight Boxing History With No Color Line

flamengo · Feb 19, 2010

Interestingly, Larry Foley had little interest in Fitz at all, seeing no capabilities as a fighter and often attempted to disuade Fitz from being a fighter.

mcvey · Feb 19, 2010

janitor said: ↑

Of course we cannot discount either Sullivan or Corbett against Jackson, but I have to think that he was the best heavyweight on the planet for a significant period.

I coulod carve out a period where I would make him favourite over either Sullivan or Corbett.

The Gazette did recognise Jackson as champion after the Killrain fight.

Perhaps this could have provided the catalyst for a Sullivan Jackson showdown.

Jackson was every bit as smart and astute as Corbett and he had a good team behind him.

He was less of a sh1t than Corbett, which you might list as a weakness.

When we take the odds of:

Jackson beating Sullivan/Corbett
Langford/McVea/Jeanette/Wills beating Johnson
Wills beating Willard/Dempsey

How likley is it that all these potential bullets are dodged?

You also have to consider the possibility of a Jimmy Braddock style black champion. Sombody who should go into the title fight as an underdog but won on the day. If an inverse colour bar had aplied, a lot of the white champions would not have been named as likley kings.

Always on the cards.

There was huge interest in matching Johnson with the more experienced versions of Langford, McVea and Jeanette and big purses were offered.

Ironicaly these fights might well have happened if Johnson had not been arested under the mann act.

That arrest is a crux point in history that could have prevented some big fights from happening.

I suspect that if you threw Joe Louis in with all of the black dynamite crew then one might beat him even at his best.

Put Johnson past his prime and the odds get interesting.

Johnson was matched between silk sheets compared to the other black dynamite members over this period.

Nobody could have fought as they did without the odd blemish.

A 40+ Johnson vs a prime Wills?

I don't know if I could make Johnson favourite.

I think that Willard is the fighter in this thread most effected by the lack of a colour bar.

Without it he is basicaly a second teir contender.

He would have had to fight the black dynamite guys to get to the front.

Not an easy task.

I don't think you see how far the ripples travel.

If Peter Jackson had beaten Corbett or Sullivan it would not only have effected the lineage but also the fights between top contenders of the day.

For example would Jeffries have even fought Corbett if his only claim to fame was drawing against Peter Jackson?
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Purse offers for Johnson to fight the black contenders were never in the same stratosphere as the purse he received for fighting a washed up Jeffries.The general public wanted a white Champion,and to get that they wanted White challengers for a black champion.
Johnson was a pragmatist, why take a chance against the tough challengers when he could make a fortune cleaning up against the paleskins, for whom, he only had to be in average shape?

This is along the same lines of thinking as Jack Kearns telling Dempsey to act in movies and shows and defend the title every couple of years, EASY MONEY,with little or no risk.

I would give Johnson a very small chance at the title when he came out of prison ,after he was dethroned by Willard.In fact about nil he was finished as a top line fighter, years of debauchery and dissipation had robbed him of his stamina ,and eroded his marvellous reflexes,he sported a roll of fat around his hips ,and an arse like a bushman in his fight with Willard, hopes that he could have come back to defeat the likes of Dempsey,Wills are "tossing pennies at the moon" [Monte Walsh]
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Heavyweight Boxing History With No Color Line

flamengo Coool as a Cucumber. Full Member

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Heavyweight Boxing History With No Color Line

flamengo Coool as a Cucumber. Full Member

mcvey VIP Member Full Member