Heavyweight GOAT over fight to the finish length?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by cross_trainer, Apr 9, 2022.


  1. cross_trainer

    cross_trainer Liston was good, but no "Tire Iron" Jones Full Member

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    Who would you consider the head to head betting favorite of all time in an unlimited rounds fight? And why?

    (1960s rules aside from the length.)
     
  2. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    I’d go for Joe Louis I think.
     
  3. djanders

    djanders Boxing Addict Full Member

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    I agree! Joe was probably the ultimate Boxer/Puncher, who carried his considerable power late, could take a good punch, and didn't waste any motions. And that's about what it would take to beat everyone else in finish fights.
     
  4. bboyrei

    bboyrei Member Full Member

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    Frazier followed by Marciano in terms of heart and stamina.
     
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  5. ikrasevic

    ikrasevic Who is ready to suffer for Christ (the truth)? Full Member

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    Lennox Lewis for H2H comparison.
    Lennox Lewis is most often mentioned as Tyson Fury's most serious opponent.
    Lennox Lewis would be the H2H favorite over both Klitschko brothers.
    I don't know how he would cope with an unlimited number of rounds, although I don't know who would recover from such a punch by Hashim Rahman (maybe Tyson Fury).
    Excellent movement coordination, great job, great finisher.
    In the fight against Joe Louis, I don't know if and how Joe Louis would be able to turn the fight into a "fight from inside", and if he didn't succeed - Joe Louis would lose.
    Lennox Lewis would overpower most world champions in heavyweight history, and for those champions where it doesn’t matter, like in the case of Muhammad Ali, there’s a great job, as a defense. Lennox Lewis would not get caught up in the "rope a dope" tactic.
    The ones he wouldn’t overpower like Foreman and Liston. There’s still a great job, and a higher IQ ring.
    I would give Sonny Liston the best chance against Lennox Lewis because of also a great (and even better) job, but in that case there is Emanuel Steward.
    Lennox Lewis + Emanuel Steward is an all-time combination.
     
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  6. Journeyman92

    Journeyman92 MONZON VS HAGLER 2025 banned Full Member

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    This is gonna be unpopular as hell. Nikolai Valuev, I’m not kidding either. IF he formed his game plans around lasting as long as possible with as much clinching and pecking as he could muster well… he’s got an iron chin and about 100lbs on most ATGs and the power to KO them when they’re worn out. But it’s based on the theoretical marathon Klit clinchko plan he’d need to formulate.
     
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  7. 70sFan865

    70sFan865 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    The question is how his stamina would hold up. We're talking about 300 lbs of body moving for hours and hours.
     
  8. Dynamicpuncher

    Dynamicpuncher Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    I'm gonna disagree with Lewis, as I don't think his stamina was the best. Against Holyfield in their 2nd meeting was exhausted after 12 rounds, against Mavrovic the samething. In this format which @cross_trainer created I don't think it suits Lewis.

    As for the topic I'd agree with Louis, Frazier, Marciano.

    What about someone like Norton ? @cross_trainer he could go 15 rounds at a hard pace.

    Put it this way in a fight to the finish, Norton may of stopped Ali in fights 1 and 3 controversial opinion.
     
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  9. Journeyman92

    Journeyman92 MONZON VS HAGLER 2025 banned Full Member

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    His stamina was alright, but if he spent a long time laying on top of them in a clinch that 300lbs is gonna do it's job faster on them then on his lungs.
     
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  10. Moggy94

    Moggy94 Active Member Full Member

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    Good pick but I don't see why Lewis couldn't overpower Sonny Liston
     
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  11. Mike Cannon

    Mike Cannon Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Bear with this, not saying he would beat one and all, but I believe Jack Johnson would be a somewhat difficult HW to fight over an unlimited distance, he had a fair ole chin ( Chyonski aside ) he was quite adept at going 15 without any visible signs of weariness ie: looked fresh and unmarked afier Jeffries ( seen better days I concede ) dito Moran/Johnson/Burns, from reports and accounts, plus as a 37 year old, out of shape champ, went 27 with Willard, in a broiling Cuban sun, would he beat LL, Foreman, Liston, Ali, No ! the really big guys have it over him agreed, most of the rest, the Tunney/Dempsey/ Pattersons might well find themselves outlasted .
    Off to bed with a cold compress to my head, and not looking on here for a week or two . stay safe guys
     
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  12. Moggy94

    Moggy94 Active Member Full Member

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    Oliver McCall

    Honourable mentions: Tyson Fury, Riddick Bowe and Evander Holyfield.
     
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  13. 70sFan865

    70sFan865 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Well, he showed his stamina in 12 rounders against mediocre competition. Imagine him fighting against an endless mover for a few hours, it could be tricky.
     
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  14. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    I'm taking Jack Johnson. Savvy enough to avoid anything. Quick enough to get big counters in himself. Conditioned enough to survive those brutal times.
     
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  15. Glass City Cobra

    Glass City Cobra H2H Burger King

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    If there are an unlimited number of rounds, then you would need a boxer who is:

    -durable
    -had decent ring IQ
    -responsible on defense
    -had decent enough power to keep people off
    -good stamina
    -can pull the trigger when the opponents hurt
    -knows how to survive
    -,paces themselves well

    There are some good candidates that you could pick that fit most or all these criteria. Holmes, Ali, Holyfield, Vitali, etc. They would be good favorites and a safe bet for their outstanding qualities.

    However I'm going to say something that may be a bit surprising and I know some will disagree: 90's Foreman might be the best candidate. Not only does he have all of the above qualities, he isn't merely "good" in some of them, he is off the charts for some.

    The smiling bald, black Buddha was as durable as a boulder. Never sitting down between any rounds just to prove a point and was never knocked down, let alone out. He was a veteran with good ring IQ and had a great grasp on the basics. He was an underrated technician at times. He was very responsible on defense and had a guard as tight as a fortress (just look at how he maintained his guard despite Hoylfield throwing a fierce 10+ punch combination from multiple angles). His power was far above decent, he possessed the most lethal clubbing fists in history with an astounding KO% and power in both hands. His stamina had vastly improved from his younger days and he had learned how to pace himself. Foreman had that killer instinct to finish a guy as soon as he sensed weakness.

    Yes, yes, he was slow as hell and could lose many rounds to more technical fighters or slippery defensive guys, but we're not talking about a conventional bout where you can hope to win on points. 90's Foreman isn't anywhere near my top 5 h2h. But if this is a literal fight to the finish until someone is declared the winner only when the other guy is KOd or can't continue, 90's Foreman may be the best candidate. He is nearly impossible to put down and would just keep coming like a tank.
     
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