Heavyweights - The 70's

I think the 90's had better depth. The 70's, if you count Holmes had more top end talent.

The 2nd half of the 1970's saw a washed up Frazier, a retired foreman, and poor title fights. Then Holmes took over.

 

It's worth noting that both eras that are generally assumed as "the best" (90's and 70's) both had their biggest fighters (Ali and Tyson) sidelined, allowing others to step up and make names for themselves in their absence.
The 70's may not of been any better than the 60's but since Ali was out it let an entire host of fighters come on the scene. When you have a dominant champ like Louis, (or Wlad, for that matter) the era is going to be called weak no matter how good the challengers actually are.

I think it's pretty much impossible to judge how good eras actually are since there's nothing to compare between them. The 90's had two old has beens in Holmes and Foreman make serious waves and beat some of the best.

 

Indeed, but I was only pointing out that while the 90's was certainly terrific era, it had its lows just as all other eras have.

 

George Foreman, one of the most protected prospects, right? He fought Frazier and destroyed him, then fought Norton and destroyed him, then fought Ali.....all this before he was even 25. Yep, what a protected bum he was atsch Foreman is a lock for top 10 ATG status when you consider his entire career.

If you consider that 'protected' then I'd like to hear your thoughts on both Klit brothers who've BOTH avoided every serious challenge for the last 10 years....and I include old ass Lewis in that by the way, even though the better brother still got his arse kicked by an old man.

Foreman only got KO'd by the universally recognised number 1 HW of all time, how is he over-rated?

I suspect you think WALDO deserves to be higher in the ATG list...your posts are always WALDO based. Now clue me up on WALDO's career before he hit 25, I'll be delighted to hear it. Then you can go on to point out WALDO's career since then - and he'd still be a MILE behind George Foreman.

 

Let's dig further

1990s had the best group of punchers of all time Lewis, Tyson, Ruddock, Tua, Bowe, Morrison, Mercer, Hide, Ibeubuchi, W Klitschko, V Klitschko, Cooper, Foreman, Seldon, etc


!950s had the best group of Stylists of all time Louis, Charles, Walcott, H Johnson, Moore, Baker, Lastarza, Machen, Folley, Patterson.


Anyone Agree?


For the record, I do agree the best two eras in HW history were 1970s and 1990s.

 

In 1993, Klitschko won the Junior European Championships as a heavyweight. In 1994, he received 2nd place at the Junior World Championships in Istanbul, Turkey. In 1995, he won the gold medal at the Military Championships in Ariccia, Italy, defeating Luan Krasniqi. In 1996, he captured 2nd place as a Super Heavyweight at the European Championships in Vejle, Denmark. He had an amateur record of 134-6.

Known as "The Steel Hammer," Klitschko first achieved world attention at the 1996 Summer Olympics in Atlanta, Georgia. He defeated Paea Wolfgramm to win the Super-Heavyweight gold medal.

On 14 October 2000, in Cologne's Kölnarena (Germany), Klitschko won the WBO Heavyweight Championship from American Chris Byrd.

^ All of this before he was 25, and he beat Chris Byrd when he was at least 7-8 years away from his prime

 

His first 28 opponents had a combined record of 477-318, a stat which is greatly enhanced by the win records of a long in the tooth (cruiserweight) Perralta, an over the hill Chuvalo and the great Boone Kirkman's 23-0.

4 of the 7 opponents he fought before Frazier had winning percentages below 30%.

Protected.

 

Really? That's news to me.

 

I will always be the first to place George Foreman in any heavyweight top 10, and agree that his destructive wins over Norton, Frazier, Lyle and Moorer were spectacular, to go along with his comeback achievements... But Seamus does have a valid point. Foreman's record is not without a certain amount of padding, especially in his prospect days leading up to the Frazier fight. That's not to say that he was protected, but certainly carefully managed, and in all likelihood, possibly even avoided. Frankly, I think that his title shot would have been better earned had he been made to go through the likes of guys like Jimmy Ellis, Jerry Quarry, Mac Foster, Oscar Bonavena, Buster Mathis, etc. as opposed to an aging Chuvalo, Antonio Peralta and a bundle full of journeyman and tomato cans.

 

I think that it was not so much the deepest era in terms of talent, as the era where nearly all the big matches were made.

Other eras could have been comparable but the big fights simply didn't happen.

 

Lets view the top 10 at each of the debated decades :
70's :
Foreman
Ali
Frazier
Holmes
Lyle
Young
Shavers
Norton


Bonavena and Chuvalo were already on the decline before the decade even started. They Did not do very much duting it.
Quarry would have always been stopped against top opposition , except Shavers.
I could not even find 10 quality fighters in that decade, despite including Holmes whom did not do very much during the 70's.


The 90's :

McCall
Holyfield
Lewis
Tua
Bowe
Tyson
Holmes
Byrd
Foreman
Puritty


Tucker , Douglas , Moorer , Larry Donald were also considered .
Before you make any comments this list was based regardless of post 90's achievements .


But even failing to find 10 quality fighters in the 70's and succeeding in finding more than 10 such in the 90's will not convince those whom see the 70's as the greatest era for HW. The 70's were the second or even third strongest HW era ever but not more than this.

 

I would include Golota, Morrison, and Ike Ibeabuchi.

 

You could include Vitali Klitschko, he won his first alphabet belt against Herbie Hide in 99 :deal

 

Ibeabuchi is a good idea which I have also briefly considered , but he had only 2 fights at the elite level. Who knows ? maybe if he got another 2 he would have gotten exposed , maybe it would have turned out the Tua fight finished him. And he never faced a taller boxer (Wlad/Vitali/Lewis/Akiwande)
Morrison ? he definitely achieved less than Puritty whom he drew with. He simply was lucky not to face Puritty's opposition. Morrison is a lock outside this top10 , he must not be ranked below Puritty.
Golotta ? who did he beat in the 90's ? another lock outside this top10.
Michael Grant should definitely be above him , same for Lance Whitaker.

 

So you include Bryd and Tua on your list but leave off Ike Ibeubuchi who beat BOTH of them? That's some nice logic franken revolver.