Henry Armstrong

I feel I have been doing Henry Armstrong a great injustice by picking too many fighters to beat him. I say we turn this thread into a bit of a tribute:

The man was a top class athlete:

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Here is an interesting comment by Armstrong, speaking of his fight with Ray Robinson:

"I almost knocked Ray out. He kept throwing those bolo punches at me. Well, I'd mastered how to defend myself against bolos from Ceferino Garcia. Ray threw one to many and I hit him with a right hand that sent him across the ring. But the bell saved him and he ran from me the rest of the fight. I couldn't catch him. I kept taunting him, 'Come on in and fight.' He just kept shaking his head and running like a scared rabbit."

Armstrong could dish it out...

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... And he could take it, too:

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I always thought Henry Armstrong looked really mean...

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... And his opponents thought so too:

"Petey Sarron, featherweight champion of the world, his face an ashen white, an empty ache in the pit of his stomach, squirmed in his seat and choked as he watched Henry Armstrong, the chocolate lancer, hammer Baby Arizmendi into the most brutal, ruthless defeat of his brilliant 11-year stretch of ring warfare last night at Wrigley Field."


"Paling perceptibly as he blinked with frightened eyes that saw Armstrong, the infernal machine, smoke the idol of Mexico out of the ring with burning, searing leather to take every one of the 10 rounds and with it recognition in California as the world's featherweight champion, Sarron aptly expressed the sentiments of the 16,000 hysterical, stunned spectators when he said: "I'm glad I'm not the one in there with Armstrong tonight."

In this thread, talk about Henry Armstrong.

 

And mine. I find Armstrong's 59-1-1 (51) streak to be the greatest run of all time.

 

Armstrong's top wins, while great, are not on the same level of Ezzard Charles', for instance. But what really does it is Armstrong's consistency during a certain period where he went 59-1-1 (both the loss and draw being very controversial), scoring 51 knockouts, over three original weight classes, beating six Hall of Famers. It's incredible. Though only a lightweight, Armstrong holds the record for welterweight title defenses!

It's a common misconception that Armstrong was finished after he lost his titles, but in reality, he was always in the picture; though Armstrong slowed down quickly, he still managed to beat top quality fighters. He trashed Hall of Famers Fritzie Zivic, Lew Jenkins (for a second time) and Sammy Angott and also beat the excellent Willie Joyce, among others, such as former champion Tippy Larkin who he knocked out with a single punch. The massive hitting Al Davis had his teeth busted. Contender Ralph Zanelli was hammered twice.

Armstrong was pretty formidable before his famous peak run as well, where he beat a couple more Hall of Famers and several contenders such as Mike Belloise and Juan Zurita.

 

With Armstrong, I take his quality over the quantity of Greb and Robinson. He was good at the start of his career and very good at the end - but in the middle, he was phenomenal.

His 59-1-1 could easily be changed to 61-0-0 with no complaints; he should have beaten Lou Ambers for the second time and won a portion of the middleweight crown off Ceferino Garcia.

During this period, Armstrong knocked out 51 of his opponents. 51! That's the same as what Joe Louis racked up in the best part of his career (60-1 (51) before the comeback), except Hank achieved it over better opposition:

It may take some time to comprehend that this run took place over three original weight divisions. And Armstrong was only a lightweight when he was breaking that welterweight defenses record. He knocked out fourteen of these challengers. At one point, Armstrong knocked out twenty seven men in a row; the third highest consecutive number in boxing history.

61-0-0 is a career for most greats. Imagine if Armstrong had that record without the other fights and losses - I'm pretty sure he'd be the consensus #1 with no questions asked. Armstrong needed those early losses to help him learn - it was a matter of trial and error, improvement; development. He burned out during his welterweight reign and then lost to someone good enough to take the title from him - a dirty **** who may have been disqualified under today's rules, Fritzie Zivic. Even when slower, battle-scarred and less agile than before, Armstrong was still beating some of the best. He did lose his consistency, but it didn't really matter because he'd already had a career's worth of magnificence from '36-'40. The pre '36 and post '40 wins, where he beat another four Hall of Famers and around twelve contenders, are just the icing on the cake.

We must remember that Armstrong didn't benefit from a glorious amateur career like Ray Robinson's and was largely a novice when he stepped into the ring in his early days.

 

Funny in what way?

I don't know who to believe; Robinson, who said he carried Armstrong, or the latter, who says Robinson wouldn't dare to exchange with him. Through no bias, I find Armstrong's account more believable seeing as he was still a top quality fighter who was knocking out a lot of people. The man was an experienced bull, and the young, spindly Robinson would probably have thought it wiser to keep his distance. By that point, Armstrong lacked the footspeed and agility of his youth to catch up to boxers and preferred a fighter to stand and trade with him.

 

I very much doubt that.

 

Maybe Armstrong meant Robinson would have always beaten him, but only if he ran.

I got this from the New York Times:

Ray Robinson, Harlem welterweight who is now a corporal in the Army, enjoyed a brisk workout at the expense of the veteran Henry Armstrong in the star bout of ten rounds at Madison Square Garden last night. Robinson enjoyed it, but nobody else in the Garden got any satisfaction from the spectacle, which was as tame as a gymnasium workout between father and son.

It doesn't tell us much apart from there wasn't much action. It supports both stories without giving a definitive answer.