Herbie Hide vs David Tua

No fighter has ever attained greatness, just by having elite power in both hands, and an elite chin.

These atributed are nothing more than a good starting point at world level.

Tua is the living proof of this.

 

Then I would say that you lack imagination.

 

Haha you are a nice joker. Even 97 Foreman would maul Tua all night long

 

We're not talking about Tua's greatness. We're not evaluating what he did during his time in the sport. We're assessing his skillset then applying that to hypotheticals. It's a very different process with different results. Like I said, you can name a score of fighters with jab and footwork that render Tua impotent. You can also name plenty of good ones who would've played into his strengths. And his strengths were very strong.

 

And you are being hypocrite because you think that Tua wins by ko

 

When you watch highlight reels of Tua knocking out cans, Nortons case looks pretty hopeless.

Now when you look at Tua in against somebody who can fight back, like say Byrd or Rahman, it suddenly doesn't look so clear cut!

 

Curiously you forgot to mention guys like michael moorer and john ruiz because they were far of being tomato cans.(of course you will say that moorer was past his prime even when you know that this was a stylistical thing and Tua destroys prime moorer)

 

Why wouldn't Norton be able to beat Tua? Do you really think that all needed to beat Norton is a punching power?

 

I'd consider Baer better, more dangerous fighter. But both were limited and I'd not bet on them against the best fighters in the division history, unless there is huge stylistic edge here.

 

I will say exactly that, because it is the truth.

The only people Tua fought, who were contenders on the day he fought them, were:

Ibeabuchi
Rahman
Lewis
Byrd
Rahman II

For whatever reason, he seemed to come up short against this class of fighter.

 

Tua at his best KO's Hide, probably inside 4 or 5 rounds.
Herbie was a good puncher, but Tua had a very good chin. Herbie didn't have that good a chin, was found out in true real class and he would not like Tua's pressure as the rounds pass. Hide's quick loss to Vitali is a case in point. It looked like he wanted out on the night.

 

Tua? Max Baer is the absolute blueprint for that. Its on film, looking like an amateur. It took him plenty of way.

 

Exactly, Baer was horrible technically but he will be defended because he fought in the Louis era if they had admitted it then automatically would be removing part of the merit from Louis career.
And Tua had better chin than Baer and probably more power

 

The thing is that every time that you think that you have found an example, it turns out not to be an example.

In order for Baer to be successful with that amateurish style, a number of other variables needed to come together.

Firstly most fighters simply do not have the reflexes, or ability to judge distances, to be successful with throwing punches like that.

If they did, then don't you think that you would see it a lot more?

Also unlike Tua, Baer had a reach advantage over most of his opponents, so closing distance was not as much of a problem.

Another necessary ingredient of Baer's success, was psychological toughness.

He had to be able to ship a lot of punishment, and continue pressing the attack.

This also is an intangible that most fighters do not posses.

Finally like every crude fighter who is successful, Baer did incorporate some technical refinements into his style.

He was very adept at countering a jab with a right hand for example, and since the jab was the main weapon people used against him, this made it a dangerous game for them.

In summary if you took a fighter out of the gym, with a dynamite punch and a granite chin, you would not be able to make another Baer!

 

This