Holmes: "Ali only trained seriously for 2 weeks for Zaire"

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Bokaj, Mar 6, 2018.


  1. Bokaj

    Bokaj Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Sounds just crazy. Could he really have slacked in training for this fight? Great clip, though.

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  2. mrkoolkevin

    mrkoolkevin Never wrestle with pigs or argue with fools Full Member

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    Are there ever any contemporaneous reports of a boxer not training for an upcoming fight? Why do we always only hear these stories after the fact?
     
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  3. Bokaj

    Bokaj Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Because they are BS most of the time.

    But this is the first time I heard a sparring partner, not the fighter himself, say that. And of a fight that fighter won. With George right there! Might he have said it just to **** off George?
     
  4. greynotsoold

    greynotsoold Boxing Addict

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    Young George over time has become a much better fighter. It is very possible that Ali saw a big, dumb, strong guy impressed with his own power that tired easily and didn't see him being a problem for a guy that knows how to fight.
     
  5. mrkoolkevin

    mrkoolkevin Never wrestle with pigs or argue with fools Full Member

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    Great point!
     
  6. robert ungurean

    robert ungurean Богдан Philadelphia Full Member

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    Larry Hates George so maybe he just wanted to keep rubbing salt into that wound
     
  7. Pat M

    Pat M Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Exactly, if Youtube had been around in the 70s and people saw all of Foreman's fights prior to the Ali fight they would have known that Foreman had some weaknesses. Ali probably saw the Peralta fights and wasn't particularly concerned about Foreman.

    I have read the piece by Norman Mailer about Ali seeing Foreman hitting the heavy bag. Mailer, with little understanding of boxing, was awed by Foreman teeing off on a bag that was held by his trainer. I can imagine that Ali was not at all impressed by that and probably thought it was funny. I agree with you too that Foreman became a much better fighter in his comeback. Too bad the young Foreman didn't have the skills and pacing of the older Foreman.
     
  8. Bokaj

    Bokaj Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Kind of have that thought myself. Ali always said he trained as a fiend for this fight and he certainly looked in shape, if a bit slow on the feet. But was the Holmes-Foreman beef already started in 1988, when this was recorded?

    Terrific way to irk George if that was his intent, though. Foreman's by far most traumatic loss, that he to this day at times comes up with the far fetched excuse of being drugged by Sadler for, and Larry says that the old guy who dismantled him hadn't even trained properly. :) He must be taking the ****, as the Brits say.
     
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  9. red cobra

    red cobra Loyal Member Full Member

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    Yeah, concerning GF, I'd take whatever Holmes says about him with a grain of salt.
     
  10. Dubblechin

    Dubblechin Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    It's bull from Larry.

    Muhammad Ali was in great shape for that fight.

    There is extensive footage of Ali training before he even left for Africa.

    There is footage of Ali training in Africa before Foreman was cut.

    The fight was then delayed nearly a month (30 days), and there is extensive footage of Ali training during that period as well.

    He basically trained three months for that bout.
     
  11. Bokaj

    Bokaj Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    What Larry said was that he trained during his whole stay in Zaire, but only 2 weeks seriously. Two weeks of "real training".

    Probably bull, as you say. Cracks me up that he said right in front of George, though.
     
  12. Dubblechin

    Dubblechin Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Again, he trained extensively before leaving for Zaire. He trained extensively in Zaire before Foreman was cut. And he trained for 30 days after Foreman was cut.

    Hell, he spent ONE WHOLE WEEK engaging in a war with Roy "Tiger" Williams, who had a beef with Ali because his (Roy's) fight was cancelled because of the fight delay and Williams had spent nearly two months himself working in preparation with Ali for his own bout ... and the delay caused his opponent to go back to the U.S.

    Ali and Williams didn't get along, and Ali and Williams 'fought' FIVE DAYS IN A ROW in Zaire because Ali wanted to beat up Williams. (Larry Holmes talked about that in his book.)

    Ali was beyond prepared for George Foreman.

    It's just a bunch of old timers ragging on each other.
     
  13. mrkoolkevin

    mrkoolkevin Never wrestle with pigs or argue with fools Full Member

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    Yeah, it’s interesting that even some of the more level-headed and skeptical Classic fans fall for this myth of young George as some indestructible force of nature with subtle, sophisticated skills, who could only be tamed by an immortal, Ali.
     
  14. Bokaj

    Bokaj Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Take a deep breath. I just clarified that Larry didn't say that Ali didn't train at all the rest of the time, he only said that it was no more than two weeks real training. Not saying that he was right. Just clarified what he said.
     
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2018
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  15. Dubblechin

    Dubblechin Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Ali had been beaten two times in his career - by Frazier and Norton.

    Foreman had impressively destroyed both in two rounds.

    Speaking of the Peralta fight, one round into Ali's fight with Foreman, Ali gave up the plan to jab and move (like Peralta) because he knew it wasn't going to work.

    Ali threw out his gameplan the night of the fight because he felt he was going to lose utilizing it.

    He just gambled and hoped that he could block and counter enough of Foreman's shots that he could make a fight of it.

    And it worked.

    Sometimes you gamble and win. But that wasn't the plan going in.

    Foreman deserved to be the favorite going in. He was on the rise. And it was one of Ali's last great performances.

    Had Ali not trained for so long, and had he not been as sharp, he likely wouldn't have done nearly as well.
     
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