Holmes or Ali - Close Calls

Holmes had the controversial wins of Witherspoon (I had Spoon up 115-114) and Williams (which I never saw). The Norton fight was also close.

Ali had Jones (I don't see the controversy), Norton, Shavers, and Young.

Ali had more.

 

In the Jones there wasn't any controversy. It was a tough fight but Ali won it, and Shavers himself admitted ali won that fight.

 

I didn't see the controversy in Ali-Jones either. I had it 6-3-1 Ali/Clay. The crowd went nuts whenever Jones threw a punch within the vicinity of Ali's head.

Ali-Shavers was another story. I really have no clue how people (especially Shavers) could score that fight for Ali. Ali would throw these flurries that mostly caught glove and arms, while Shavers landed the harder shots.

I had it 9-6 Shavers, and I felt I was being a tad generous to Ali.

 

Probably Ali.

 

Definitely Ali. Holmes had close fights with Witherspoon, Williams, etc., but he has also some controversial L´s like against Nielsen or Spinks, Ali on the other side should have at least 3 more L´s in his record, so IMO it´s pretty clear here...

 

What are these so called "three or more losses" you talk about?

 

I can't speak for him, but i thought Norton III and Young were decisive losses. Many had him losing the Shavers fight as well.

Bottomline is that Ali always got the positive edge in close fights, whereas Holmes had decisions going against him that shouldn't have, in addition to receiving a few decisions in close fights.

 

I've watched and scored the Doug Jones fight on several occasions and *always* have Ali (er, Clay) ahead by a round at the end. Jones did good, but if you want to seriously argue that he deserved the nod you need to tell me which rounds you think he won. I think one judge scored Ali as pitching a shutout, which is absolutely nuts, though.

The third Norton fight, however, I scored for Norton by one round the only time I watched the whole fight with scoring in mind. I was very comfortable with my judging on that one, FWIW, I do think Ali benefited from his status as a legend.

 

Young stuck his head out of the ropes every other round. Giving the fight and title to Young would have caused more controversy than what actually happened, IMO.

As for the Norton fight, 22 reporters were polled after the fight and 11 scored the fight for Ali, and 11 for Norton, so it's not such a clear-cut robbery, IMO.

 

Ali had more close calls go his way, and unlike Holmes was never robbed by the judges.

 

And Ali blatantly held behind the head. Big deal. Every fighter fouls one way or another.

Mainly because Ali was by far the public's favorite. But you can't deny that the Nielsen and Spinks fights went against Holmes, whereas Ali never suffered from such event.

 

Bingo! :thumbsup