HOLMES V NORTON - Great Fight.... BUT

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Bill Butcher, Sep 11, 2008.


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  1. Bill Butcher

    Bill Butcher Erik`El Terrible`Morales Full Member

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    This should have been a unanimous decision for Larry Holmes.

    The last 3 rds were special as they went toe to toe but for the most part Holmes was outboxing Ken Norton.

    1 judge had Norton a 143-142 winner, the other judges were only marginally better, both having Holmes a 143-142 winner. I thought Larry won wider than that.

    Ps. What about Muhammad Ali`s prediction 10 mins before the fight - Holmes by split decision, nice pick.

    :thumbsup
     
    Bill Butcher, Sep 11, 2008
    Bill Butcher, Sep 11, 2008
    #1
  2. Holmes' Jab

    Holmes' Jab Master Jabber Full Member

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    I had: 8-6 Holmes, with one even round. Larry did enough in the final exchanges.
     
    Holmes' Jab, Sep 11, 2008
    Holmes' Jab, Sep 11, 2008
    #2
  3. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. banned Full Member

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    Holmes won cleanly in a tough match up. 9-6 or 8-6-1 are good scores. I do think Norton might have won the final round though.
     
    Mendoza, Sep 11, 2008
    Mendoza, Sep 11, 2008
    #3
  4. ChrisPontius

    ChrisPontius March 8th, 1971 Full Member

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    Ali wanted everything but get back an other time in the ring with Norton.
     
    ChrisPontius, Sep 11, 2008
    ChrisPontius, Sep 11, 2008
    #4
  5. quintonjacksonfan

    quintonjacksonfan Active Member Full Member

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    All three judges had it tied going into the last round.
     
    quintonjacksonfan, Sep 11, 2008
    quintonjacksonfan, Sep 11, 2008
    #5
  6. My dinner with Conteh

    My dinner with Conteh Tending Bepi Ros' grave again Full Member

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    Norton won final round, no doubt. But Holmes rightful winner. I had it 9-5 going into the 15th. Holmes dominated first half of fight.
     
    My dinner with Conteh, Sep 11, 2008
    My dinner with Conteh, Sep 11, 2008
    #6
  7. Bill Butcher

    Bill Butcher Erik`El Terrible`Morales Full Member

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    Exactly the way I had it.
     
    Bill Butcher, Sep 11, 2008
    Bill Butcher, Sep 11, 2008
    #7
  8. natonic

    natonic Boxing Addict Full Member

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    I re-watched this recently and It seemed like Holmes controlled most of the fight. I was surprised when I added up my scorecard. I think I had Holmes by 2. It didn't seem that close to me. Real good fight though.
     
    natonic, Sep 11, 2008
    natonic, Sep 11, 2008
    #8
  9. Bill Butcher

    Bill Butcher Erik`El Terrible`Morales Full Member

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    Ali was all done by then.

    The 1st fight, Ali came in stupidly out of shape & lost clearly.
    The 2nd fight Ali came in ready & won close but clear.
    The 3rd fight Ali was shot & lucky to get the verdict.

    Prime v prime Ali wins 11-4 in a 15 rder, imagine the 1st half of fight 2 except for the entire fight.
    Norton would be lucky to do any better than Terrell or Chuvalo IMO.

    :thumbsup
     
    Bill Butcher, Sep 11, 2008
    Bill Butcher, Sep 11, 2008
    #9
  10. anut

    anut Boxing Addict banned

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    i scored it 115 to 114 for holmes.....close....but holmes won.
     
    anut, Sep 11, 2008
    anut, Sep 11, 2008
    #10
  11. ChrisPontius

    ChrisPontius March 8th, 1971 Full Member

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    Well, he'd certainly do better than Terrel since he barely won a round. I'd expect something like a 9-6 decision for Ali at his peak. Chuvalo gave Ali a pretty rough one. I will add that even the in late 60's, Ali didn't constantly dance, as the Chuvalo and Terrel fights illustrate.
     
    ChrisPontius, Sep 12, 2008
    ChrisPontius, Sep 12, 2008
    #11
  12. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. banned Full Member

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    Norton might have scored a knockdown, or maybe even a TKO vs Ali in the first fight if it was 15 rounds.

    Ali had trouble vs top jabbers at ALL phases of his career. Doug Jones, Norton, Lyle, Young, and when he was well past it, vs Holmes.

    Norton might have been able to beat Ali in the 1960's, in fact if he had 3 chances I think he would win one of them.
     
    Mendoza, Sep 12, 2008
    Mendoza, Sep 12, 2008
    #12
  13. JohnThomas1

    JohnThomas1 VIP Member

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    Not against Terrell he didn't

    ;)
     
    JohnThomas1, Sep 12, 2008
    JohnThomas1, Sep 12, 2008
    #13
  14. Bill Butcher

    Bill Butcher Erik`El Terrible`Morales Full Member

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    Agreed... BUT you will notice that.....

    1. Ali only went flatfooted when in control & with a decent lead in the fight.

    2. Ali could immediately start dancing at any time throughout a 15 rd fight from 1-15 rds.

    3. Any time Ali did get on his toes there wasnt a sinlge opponent that didnt start dropping rds to him as he was so fluid.

    4. Norton`s style would trouble Ali enough that Ali would make sure he gets on his toes more than he did vs Terrell & Chuvalo once he realises that boxing flatfooted is were Ken is most dangerous.

    Ps. I do agree that Ali wins at least 9 rds in his prime vs Norton in a 15 rder, even more if he doesnt mess around boxing flatfooted for long spells.

    :thumbsup
     
    Bill Butcher, Sep 12, 2008
    Bill Butcher, Sep 12, 2008
    #14
  15. Bill Butcher

    Bill Butcher Erik`El Terrible`Morales Full Member

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    Top line - If it was 15 rds then we would likely have seen an in shape Ali - probably world champ too since its 15 rds - & it would have resembled the 2nd fight more than the 1st fight since were talking if`s.

    2nd line - You can remove the Holmes, young & 3rd Norton fights from there as the man should have been retired by then.
    Before that, he went 1-1 with Ken, beat Doug Jones close but clear & stopped Lyle so if good jabbers were a problem for him then they at least werent a HUGE problem.

    Last line - Specifically, the Ali of which fight from Liston-Folley (we did say primes) would you fancy Norton to beat ?

    No need for a rematch after seeing this one & he aint getting 3 chances because Ali would be 2-0 up if there even was a rematch which I doubt.

    :thumbsup
     
    Bill Butcher, Sep 12, 2008
    Bill Butcher, Sep 12, 2008
    #15
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