Holyfield had to fight real contenders at HW to get his shot.... shouldn't Usyk have to do the same?

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by Oakland Billy Smith, Oct 20, 2019.

  1. KeedCubano

    KeedCubano Member Full Member

    Jul 21, 2019
    Why don't they?

    Gassiev, Briedis, Glowacki and Hunter all beat Evander's best opponents.
    Glowacki, Huck, Briedis, Gassiev and Bellew are all top 10 CWs of all time, or have a case to be. Not one of Holyfield's do.

    Before you say Qawi does, he has a very poor record at CW. A win over Leon Spinks does not make him a top 10 CW, he's more like an ATG LHW. Tillman wasn't ever very good and DeLeon's best wins are over a shot LHW contender and a past prime Burlon who didn't beat anyone.
    They may have fought 15, it's not really relevant. Where's the evidence that they throw more?
    What relevance does fouling have?
    I have watched the fights, I love watching Holyfield and Qawi but I know there limits, well Qawi's.
    The ****s this? Are you on there payroll?
    Serge and George Crowcroft like this.
  2. Holler

    Holler Doesn't appear to be a paid matchroom PR shill Full Member

    Mar 12, 2018
    Also worth mentioning that he beat Hunter in the US, Huck in Germany, Briedis in Latvia, Gassiev in Russia, Glowacki in Poland, and of course since moving up Bellew in the UK and Witherspoon in the US.
  3. DoubleJab666

    DoubleJab666 October 31st, 2019 Full Member

    Nov 9, 2015

    And his first choice for HW debut was Takam. A fight he would have won, but a tough bow regardless.

    He's 32, had one pro HW fight and is now happy to take on Ruiz or AJ in his next fight. To me that's commendable. The fact the WBO are facilitating that is not his fault.
    Serge, Dirsspaardis, BCS8 and 2 others like this.
  4. Heisenberg

    Heisenberg Active Member Full Member

    Apr 30, 2017
    Holyfield eased in with Tillis and a very shot Pinklon Thomas but then fought four consecutive top ten ranked contenders in Stewart, Dokes, Adilson Rodriguez and Seamus McDonagh. His first title reign opposition was Douglas, Foreman, Cooper, Holmes and an absolute best ever Bowe. Usyk isn’t going to come close a resume like that... and Holyfield was overrated?
    MrFoFody likes this.
  5. Badbot

    Badbot Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

    Apr 17, 2011
    What exactly did Holyfield to at Cruiserweight? He fought a bunch of nobodies and then took a massive step up in Quawi.
    Beat Quawi twice and then what? Unified with De Leon and Parkey.

    Usyk beat: Huck, Hunter, Briedis, Gassiev, Bellew, Mchunu and Glowacki. So yes, there is a strong argument for Usyk having the better resume at Cruiserweight.
  6. Dangerwood84

    Dangerwood84 Active Member Full Member

    Sep 21, 2017
    Holyfield was my favourite fighter when I was younger and I won money on him against Tyson. I know it's different times mainly due to the internet but Usyk became a much bigger star by unifying cruiserweight than Holyfield. I don't know what it was like in the states but Usyk became a 'name' that's why he'll get a quick shot. Holyfield was a name for fight fans only before his heavyweight days. Maybe he was bigger in the U.S.
    Serge, Holler and BCS8 like this.
  7. Lith

    Lith Boxing Addict Full Member

    Jul 16, 2010
    This is such a weird pointless thread, still with comments suggesting Usyk's fame or connections are getting him the shot despite numerous posts already explaining exactly what is going on.

    Lets keep it simple. This is a WBO rule, Usyk would not be the first and won't be the last to use it.

    In case people don't realise, he can ONLY use that rule to contend for the WBO belt - so the odds are that if he exercises that, he will only have the WBO belt on the line. If he beats the winner of AJ/Joshua then he will only take one of their belts unless they volunteer the others up. THAT will come down to money, and what Hearn thinks is worth the investment.

    I suspect everyone would see it a bigger investment if Usyk had to fight his way for unification at HW, so the WBO belt will be the only one up for grabs.
    Serge and kostya by ko like this.
  8. catchwtboxing

    catchwtboxing Boxing Addict Full Member

    Jul 4, 2014
    It is s an extremely weak era. In principle, you may have something here. In reality, most of us are glad for an intriguing champ going into the heavies.

    Besides, Usyk Vs anyone is hardly the worst fight in heavyweight history. There are these things called optional defenses, and some ****-awful fighters have gotten shots.
  9. PernellSweetPea

    PernellSweetPea Boxing Junkie Full Member

    Feb 26, 2009
    Holyfield was incredible. The big guys he fought at heavyweight and still did well. Had he been of equal size, he would have beaten everyone easily. That Dokes fight was brutal, and Dokes was a big guy and Evander wore him out.
  10. BCS8

    BCS8 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

    Aug 21, 2012
    In principle I wouldn't be too bothered by Usyk having to fight his way to a title fight, except for that people will inevitably start to say that he's protecting his 0 by fighting a bunch of bums and that he needs to step it up. I feel that what he's done at CW more than qualifies him for a crack at one of the many crowns. He's way better than Stiverne, Takam, Breazeale and certainly Charr, all of whom got their shot.
    Serge, Robney and KeedCubano like this.
  11. NoNeck

    NoNeck Pugilist Specialist Full Member

    Apr 3, 2012
    Dokes was a top ten contender.
  12. Liquorice

    Liquorice Boxing Addict Full Member

    May 13, 2018
    The steroids were strong back then
    Serge likes this.
  13. Robney

    Robney ᴻᴼ ᴸᴼᴻᴳᴲᴿ ᴲ۷ᴵᴸ Full Member

    Jan 18, 2010
    Besides it being down to a rule in this case, why don't people complain about the likes of Spinks and RJJ, who both jumped up from 175 to a titleshot (winning) without having fought a single fight at heavyweight before that.
    Serge and BCS8 like this.
  14. Dance84

    Dance84 Unicorn and seastar land Full Member

    Oct 11, 2017
    to be honest i will agree with others sometimes that maybe usyk needs a few more fights at heavyweight to get use to the weight

    however as a fan i do not like to wait , im just waiting for the AJ Ruiz winner first has to dealt with.

    even then when AJ and Ruiz are done the winner may face pulev or decide to unify with wilder ....

    i know there are more important fights out there than a mandatory

    but the prospect of usyk being tested by these big boys is just so mind boggling
    BCS8 likes this.
  15. Jackman65

    Jackman65 Member Full Member

    Aug 31, 2019
    Usyk cleaned out the CW division. His performance was historic and he’s a big name. Same way Ward stepped up to LHW and immediately got to fight the top guy. Why was it fair for Ward? Ward was out of boxing for a long stretch before he got his shot. Andre took some tuneups but that was by choice. He won a questionable first fight and a dirty second fight and scurried into retirement. At least Usyk is planning to stick around at the weight and defend the belt if he wins.

    Boxing is about money. When top guys, especially guys who unify, move up, they get to fight for a belt if they choose. Same thing happened when Canelo moved up (even though he never unified), when Floyd or Manny moved up they got to pick their opponents because they brought a fan base and $$$. Why didn’t they have to fight lower ranked guys and earn the right to fight for a strap?
    Serge and BCS8 like this.

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