Holyfield Or Marciano - Chin

I would not.
But then I wouldn't expect a 37 year old Ali, Holmes, Dempsey, Tyson or Holyfield to have much chance against a Joe Louis still in his 20s either !

 

Marciano...he had a frightful tolerance for pain...

 

I am not sure what you are talking about but if you mean gambling, I have been very lucky betting on boxing but I also had quite a few losses when I bet with my heart. No one can be certain when it comes to betting against the era's but unfortunately the classic forum has been taken over by youngsters who start out by eliminating all of the black and white film fighters

 

Agreed but many here, time and time again have made the argument that Maciano's victory over Louis was a significant accomplishemtn and proof of how he could over come big punchers and a huge dise disadvantage ... this against a 37 year old Joe Louis no less ..

 

Well, I see what you are saying, but it wasn't a meaningless victory.

I think he would beat some bigger men who were good punchers, based entirely on the fact that he was a very good - great even ! - smaller heavyweight.
Just like a lot of great welterweights we would expect to beat some of the bigger powerful 154 or 160 pounders.

 

No doubt. However it is not a victory to base all time credentials upon ...

 

That's fine, and you've clearly got your head screwed on right when it comes to analyzing it. I have no qualms about Louis being #1 and P4P Moore could be argued the same along with Langford, Fitzsimmons.

The problem with Joe is that so much of his punching ability in addition to fundamentals was his speed, timing and reflexes. Against Marciano, he had only the former left. With a guy like Foreman, it was jackhammer brute force. Even 'Old' Foreman would make the cut on a list of the top 5 biggest HW hitters. He was a freak of nature.

Tyson's skills eroded even more significantly after Holyfield, but I'd chalk much of that up to the 18 month layoff and general disinterest once he popped off the handle and lost the rematch. Even then, he was still dropping professional fighters with a single shot. However sketchy he was post-Holyfield, he clearly had more in the tank than the respective versions of Louis and Walcott, who never fought again post-Marciano. Against Holyfield (as the same is argued for Walcott against Marciano), he was still a world class fighter.

Lewis - who also made the list - had some of the heaviest hands in HW history. Very few would argue the level he was at when he locked horns with a battle worn Holyfield in 1999.

Riddick Bowe didnt make the list, but Holyfield undoubtedly got the best from him as well. Has there been a super heavyweight who put combinations together like peak Bowe? One of the most dissapointing fighters in history for me because he had every physical attribute, all the tools and skills needed to be great, briefly showed he WAS great and then fell off a cliff.

 

I can't split them, really.

Rocky was rarely ever hurt(Like twice), whereas Holyfield certainly was a good deal more often, but Rocky simply didn't fight the punchers Holyfield did.


I think they both had amazing jaws.

 

Holyfield faced the likes of Foreman, Lewis, Bowe and Tyson no fewer than eight times combined alone. The single time he got stopped, he couldnt even support his own weight and was crashing face first into the canvas before Bowe even connected with the shot on the first KD. Turns out Hepatitus A is pretty difficult to fight at an elite level with (sarcasm) and Evander still managed to put on a courageous effort again. The only one of these four that didnt hold a significant size advantage over him in addition to their power, ability and skills was Tyson who can be easily canceled out on the grounds of: It's Mike Tyson. :deal

 

It's possible but unlikely considering the increased leverage Bowe, in particular, would have on those uppercuts on the inside due to Marciano's height disadvantage.

 

I strongly believe it's only truly relevant & fair to compare the chin of Marciano with Cruiserweight Holy. All of the high quality opponents Marciano fought were between the weights of a dehydrated or in one case rehydrated (Walcott II) Cruiser of the original 190lb Cruiser limit. Nobody can possibly accurately speculate how the 184lb Rocky would take atomic bombs to the chin from skillful deadly punchers of relatively gigantic size such as a 222lb Tyson, 235lb Bowe, & 245lb Lewis. Don't dare try to compare those guys to a 1951, Shot Louis who at age 37, was a soft 14lbs heavier than at his absolute Peak 13 years earlier.

 

Tyson cannt beat Marciano.

Reference: Fight Night Champion

 

You've got a good point there brah, in Fight Night Champion, Tyson can bounce his best nukes in combinations off Marciano's chin for 5 rounds, then get KO'd for being gassed in the 6th. :yep

 

Only when your Tyson :hey:hey:hey


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