Holyfield's amazing transformation

And do you not understand the euphemism "short cuts"? I'm well aware of the evidence of Holyfield's use of PEDs, and am agreeing with it - I'm just bringing up the point, from the trainer (along with Lee Haney) most associated with his initial building phase into heavyweight that, after a certain point, he wasn't as dedicated an athlete and probably relied on "short cuts" (PEDs) to substitute for conditioning.

Dial it down a bit, OK?

 

I did not attack you personally or say anything overheated to have you ask me to dial anything down.
Anyway nobody can tell from what you wrote that you were aware of the evidence against Holyfield.
Read what you wrote again-you speculated that he relied on short cuts, not that the others said this, one person merely said he liked to party, which does not suggest anything illegal or even that he might have resorted to cheating.

Apparently you not Haney & his trainer speculated he probably relied on short cuts.
I am saying that even if the overwhelmingly hard training boxer eventually became less dedicated, that would not be convincing evidence that he ever cheated.

Muscle has memory, & especially when you use PEDs effectively it does not take that much to maintain strength & muscle mass. So he could have used mainly or entirely when initially approaching his peak strength & muscle mass...Maybe cycling on & off, which could well account for his varying energy & performance levels, when he balded, the seeming then vanishing heart problems, etc.

But the results of official investigations repeatedly tying him to being supplied with steroids & HGH are what is specific evidence that is highly unlikely to be mistaken.

 

Not sure about that. To start with, I wouldn't be all surprised if Tyson was on steroids from an early age, and Holy was also strong for his size. Bowe named him his strongest opponent and even in their first fight, when Holy was only 205, he continually pushes the 30 lbs heavier Bowe back.

 

"But do you not read the threads before you post?" My reading comprehension is quite adequate, thanks ...

I feel like I'm defending myself from a position where I agree with you - no idea where this went off tangent, but no desire to pursue it. Some people like to argue for the sake of arguing. I'm not one of them.

Toodles.

 

Haney didn’t do much. The brains behind that operation was a guy named Ty “Ropeman” Felder. Felder had certain connections here in Atlanta in the early to mid 90’s that a lot of other athletes and trainers didn’t have period.

 

And flattering lighting

 

If you'd actually read my posts, you'd know you don't have to sell me me on the idea that Holy took HGH and probably other PEDs.

What I've said is that that picture certainly isn't from 1990 and probably doctored in some way. Either that or it's taken in a way that really gives the wrong impression of how Holy's body looked even in 1987. If you look at him in the first Qawi fight, he looks clearly bigger with a much more pronounced muscle tone than in that picture.

 

Lots of claims are made against boxers, without any hard evidence and, while we can speculate all we like, to the best of my knowledge, Holyfield never failed a commission-prescribed drugs test.

The type of gains in muscle we see in Holyfield are achievable without the use of experimental/illegal enhancers.

While one might consider Holyfield a likely user of PEDs, likelihood, isn't proof.

 

People tend to overlook that boxing was Holyfields job- thats it.
Now all he did was work out and rest week after week. Has the best of everything available to him-protien,recovery supplements,trainers,etc.
You take someone off the streets and let them train full time without worrying about a job,bills etc give them the best equipment,supplements,trainers etc you would be shocked at what they could achieve.

 

Had a friend that came into some money and he decided to take a year off work and concentrate on himself.
So he didnt have to work at all so he decided he wanted to hit the gym as he always wanted to get bigger and ripped.
He started going once a day for a couple of months.
Started meal prepping weekly.
Then he started going to the gym twice a day.
By the end of the year he was ripped and alot bigger then when he started.
I asked him what made the difference and he told me not worrying about having to get up and go to work made it so much easier.

 

I just watched Lewis-Holyfield II

Ol' Lewis. Clean as a daisy.

That must have been Larry Merchant's worst moment. He was wronger than wrong. All fight long.

 

Good win against an Undisputed Champion coming off the biggest upset of all time. Kinda like Vitali's win over Sanders , except no-belt and inactive Sanders is Vitali's best win , Holyfield has many other better wins than Undisputed Buster Douglas.

Want another stat? Holyfield spent 6 years ranked on the P4P list. At one stage he was ranked third on the P4P list. Vitali in a 20 year long career never came close to being ranked on the P4P list...
Holyfield >> Vitali... Historically and combatively

 

This. My buddy Ronny Turiaf, who was a top flight college basketball player also worked with Lee Haney to put on size and out of nowhere went from 220 lbs to 250 lbs, but like Holyfield developed heart problems and had to have life saving surgery. Haney was putting everybody and their mother on Equipose back in they day