Honest Mike Tyson Question

sauhund II · Aug 22, 2019

Two great guys, Michael Spinks and our President........

Reinhardt · Aug 22, 2019

Oddone said: ↑

Every Mike Tyson thread turns into a train wreck. We all get that. Please try to be civil if possible.

Now to the point. As someone fairly new to boxing I was impressed to learn that Mike Tyson fought seven current or former world champions in his first thirty five fights. Yet every forum I read said he fought nobodies. Debate the “quality” of the heavyweight division at the time all you want, but I don’t think they were bums or nobodies. What’s the deal?
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Well in the age of 3 to 4 champions per division facing 7 isn't a measuring stick. , it was a weak era but to his credit Tyson treated them as such. A lot of the guys he beat would be in the mix today in the heavyweight division.

Glass City Cobra · Aug 22, 2019

GOAT Primo Carnera said: ↑

What was that

Well lets also check what Spinks himself thought:

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Or the guy who fought both of them:

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That's cool. I can just as easily post various predictions from respectable figures who thought spinx would win. Oh wait, i already did.

What was the point of your post again?

Anyone can sound well informed in hindsight. Had spinx somehow gone the distance and lost a competitive bout people would be calling him a granite chinned top 5 h2h atg. But because tyson made it look easy spinx is considered a joke and no one wants to give tyson credit. You can post all the emojis and interviews you want, it doesnt change the fact that many people thought this would be another fight of the century and gave spinx a big chance of winning.

L.Everett · Aug 22, 2019

I think a big part of this "Tyson fought nobodies" trend has been fostered by Teddy Atlas whose built up quite a fan base over the years. I like Teddy's commentating, don't get me wrong, but he has a history of bias towards Tyson and other fighters he once trained, he famously held up a 15 year old Mike at gunpoint. Atlas has built himself up as a paragon of just trying to call out the filth in the corrupt seedy underworld of boxing, which is why many like him, but he's justice as dirty and self-interested as the next guy. Take what he says with a grain of salt.

choklab · Aug 22, 2019

Spinks was given the best chance to beat Tyson but Tyson was seen as unbeatable. And it is no wonder since he was knocking everyone out.

I don’t think Teddy Atlas has anything to do with a perception that Tyson fought nobodies. They were not nobodies. So that cannot stand up.

It’s just whenever there is a dominant champion you have to assess things like quality of opposition and ring activity ...and how advantageous as factors these might be.

Tonto62 · Aug 22, 2019

Glass City Cobra said: ↑

I dont remember the exact words being that the odds were 50/50 but thats the way some people saw and hyped it up at the time. They thought it would be one of the greatests fights of all time and some not only gave spinx a strong chance of winning, some even considered spinx the worthy champion.

“This is the biggest fight in history,” Finkel says.

"The fight was billed as "Once And For All." This was a fight between two undefeated fighters, each with a legitimate claim to the heavyweight championship of the world."

"Everything points to Tyson-Spinks generating more money by far than any fight in history -- about $70 million."

"Instead of defending his IBF title against top contender [url]Tony Tucker[/url], Spinks elected to take a more lucrative fight with former contender [url]Gerry Cooney[/url], who had fought three times in five years, in June 1987. The IBF responded by stripping Spinks of the title, but he was still in possession of the lineal and Ring titles and was considered by many to still be the rightful champion.[url][1][/url][url][5][/url][url][7][/url][url][8][/url]"

"the fight was highly anticipated and earned comparisons with the 1971 [url]Fight of the Century[/url] between [url]Joe Frazier[/url] and [url]Muhammad Ali[/url], who were also undefeated heavyweight champions when they met to decide the undisputed title.[url][7][/url][url][8][/url][url][18][/url] "

[url]Ray Arcel[/url] thought Tyson would win on points.[url][31][/url]

Muhammad Ali thought Spinks would win, as "he hits hard enough, he'll stick and move, he's fast on his feet, and he'll keep his distance."[url][28][/url][url]Tony Zale[/url] and sportswriter [url]Bert Sugar[/url] backed Spinks to out-box Tyson.[url][29][/url][url][30][/url][url][32][/url] [url]Dave Anderson[/url] of the [url]New York Times[/url] wrote that Spinks would win, "probably in a 12-round decision. But possibly in a late-round knockout."[url][18][/url] Reigning [url]WBA welterweight[/url]champion [url]Marlon Starling[/url], veteran announcer [url]Don Dunphy[/url] and Tyson's former trainer [url]Teddy Atlas[/url] also favoured Spinks.[url][29][/url][url][30][/url] Contender [url]Meldrick Taylor[/url] felt Tyson would win if it ended in a knockout, but favoured Spinks if it went the distance.[url][28][/url] 1940s middleweight champion [url]Rocky Graziano[/url] predicted Spinks would "psych out Tyson, then knock the hell out of him."[url][33][/url] [url]Archie Moore[/url] gave Spinks "a wonderful chance" of winning.[url][28][/url] [url]Floyd Patterson[/url], who like Tyson had been trained by [url]Cus D'Amato[/url], said "I originally picked him [Tyson], and I still do, but now I give Spinks a chance."[url][34][/url]

You do not estimate that a fight will the most profitable in history, compare it it to the fight of the century, and have so many noteworthy boxing figures calling it even or believing spinx might win if everyone honestly thought Tyson would easily win if they didnt think it was close to being an even matchup. All this stuff about people writing spinx off as another highlight reel bum isn't just historically innacurate, its a lie and revisionist history.
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Good post with some excellent info!

Tonto62 · Aug 22, 2019

Unforgiven said: ↑

The fighters Tyson beat in the 1980s are actually regarded higher now than they were at the time.
There were never "nobodies" though. They were high ranked heavyweights at the time.
The division was considered weak at the time. Erratic and lazy fighters were filling up the ranks. Fighters who had one or two decent fights then fell off the radar. It had been going on for a few years when Tyson came along. And he did what a good fighter was supposed to do. He beat them.
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This is the sensible view to take ,imo.

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