How anyone can think the 03-05 Pac is better than the 08-10 version??!

I agree. His KOs of Diaz and Hatton were awesome single-shots. Obviously bigger, heavier man can hold his shots better, but he still badly hurts them. If Pac had stayed in the 135-140 range he'd have been one of the most concussive punchers on the planet.

 

I think Pac did fire back well when he was trapped against the ropes in the Margarito fight.

However, I honestly believe Pac purposefully allowed Cotto, Clottey and Margarito to put some leather on him. Against Cotto, I think it was quite clear that Pac let him fire off punches against the ropes to make the point that he could take welterweight punches and come back stronger. Against Clottey, Pac was letting Clottey punch in order to try and bring him out of his shell a bit so he could land cleanly with counters (the tactic was not overly successful I will admit, due to Clottey's extreme caution). Against Margarito, I think Pac simply wanted to get into a tear-up, once more to make a point that he does not have to run to beat a bigger man. I think it was pretty clear in that fight that Pac could've ran and flicked out punches and boxed his way to a dull UD, but that's just not him (thankfully).


In saying all of this, I still accept that Pac could improve both his defence and offence on the inside. Those are not the strongest areas of his game at all. He does seem easy to hit with uppercuts, and Amir Khan seems to suffer from the same weakness. Is this something Roach overlooks in his training perhaps???

 

I strongly disagree, for this reason:

Pacquiao's real peak fighting weight range would've been 135-140, had he stayed there. The Pac of the Hatton, Oscar and Diaz fights was where he best combined the physical and skill sides of his game. He had the same physical abilities he has now, but he was facing men closer to his own size, and he was on the right side of his evolution from the one-two happy threshing machine of 03-05 to the two-handed p4p#1 assassin we see today.

 

All I can say here is that I disagree. I really do.

I think Pac's best weight range was 135-140 as I've already said, but even at 147, guys like Cotto, Margarito and Hatton aren't even testing him. They are struggling to even win a round or two against him.

I don't think Pac was as dominant as this vs inferior fighters like Solis and Larios at 130.

 

So essentially what you are saying is that at no point in his career has Pacquiao been good enough to clearly and convincingly defeat fighters of the calibre of 2004 Marquez or 2005 Morales?? :huh

As I said, I disagree totally.

The featherweight Marquez lost to fighters like Freddie Norwood and Chris John, and struggled with an old, declined MA Barrera.

For all his big fight battling performances, Erik Morales has rarely produced the kind of ultra-dominant displays to leave lesser opponents utterly demolished - see how he had to go to war in order to get past guys like Wayne McCullough, In Jin Chi and Guty Espadas Jr.


Now compare this with the lww/ww Pacquiao!

He barely loses a round when completely devastating fighters like Cotto, Margarito and Hatton. Now, not only are these fighters better p4p than the likes of Norwood, John, McCullough, Chi and Espadas, but they all hold physical advantages over Pacquiao which those fighters did not have over Marquez and Morales.

In short, Pacquiao is beating bigger and better fighters than Marquez and Morales managed... and doing so more impressively and dominantly than they managed.


The current version of Pacquiao is simply a higher level fighter than JMM or El Terrible. That's why he is now regarded as the p4p#1, which neither of them were even close to in '04 and '05.

If Pacquiao fought a Marquez or Morales calibre fighter at ww now, they would find he has better footwork, better movement, a better jab, better combination punching (as he is now deadly with both hands), yet still retains the bulk of his speed, power and stamina.

Fights that were a draw (in '04) and a loss (in '05) would now be victories, even allowing for the physical advantages that a Marquez/Morales calibre fighter would have over him considering we are talking about them being natural welterweights.

If the welterweight version of Marquez would lose to the welterweight versions of Norwood and John, how is he going to beat the current version of Pacquiao?

If the welterweight version of Morales had to go into the trenches to get past lesser fighters such as welterweight versions of McCullough, Chi and Espadas, how is he going to beat the current version of Pacquiao?


Don't get me wrong, both a ww JMM and a ww '05 EM would give '08-'10 Manny Pac a far harder fight than Cotto or Margarito or Hatton or Clottey have managed, but that doesn't mean they'd have enough to win. Pac would outspeed and outfight them both. He is the higher level fighter now.

:deal